60% of registered doctors in 2010 are foreigners!

[makapaaa]

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[TD="class: msgtxt"][h=2]60% of registered doctors in 2010 are foreigners![/h]Due to the recent spike in requests for counselling support, we are looking out for more volunteers to join us as counsellors and coaches. If you are qualified and want to be part of our volunteering team, please email me at [email protected]. Cheers!
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CNA reported that Minister of State for Manpower and National Development, Tan Chuan-Jin said discriminatory practices have no place in Singapore.Speaking at the Singapore Tripartism Forum on Monday, he said tripartite partners are aware that many Singaporeans have expressed anxieties of discriminatory practices at their work place, including allegations of foreign managers hiring their own kind.Discriminations of Singaporeans at the work places are finally getting some media and PAP’s attention.
Doctors should be at least 90% citizens. We do not mind importing 10% of the best talent FT doctor to
mentor us.
.

Source: Singapore Medical Council
On 2010, 331 Singaporeans received full and conditional medical registration (aka registering to be a doctor) and for foreigner doctors, the number is a whopping 484. [see this].
Only around 40% of registered doctors for year 2010 are Singaporeans.

Probably, most Singaporean doctors are trained overseas funded by parents. PAP wants to give FT doctors high pay by controlling local medical school intake.We must increase citizen medical students’ intake in our local university. Those exceptional FT doctors are welcome here to transfer their expert medical know how.
FT doctors should also not be more than 10% of annual doctor registration in Singapore.
http://veritas-lux.blogspot. com/2011/10/singapore-news- update-31th-oct-2011.html
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[THE_CHANSTER]

I think you'll find that the majority come from our neighbors up north.

 

[tanwahtiu]

Much more changes can be made only if the voters are matured enough to know how to vote the PAP out of office. Tony Tan won't be President if only the voters has had voted the PAP out. Time to bull doze and disperse PAP like they did to Hillview Ave Est voters.

 

[bryanlim1972]

Much more changes can be made only if the voters are matured enough to know how to vote the PAP out of office. Tony Tan won't be President if only the voters has had voted the PAP out. Time to bull doze and disperse PAP like they did to Hillview Ave Est voters.

i'm sorry but what's wrong with having so many foreign doctors (if they are fully qualified)? are you trying to protect the turf of local doctors so they can charge us astronomical consultation fees?

 

[kopiuncle]

nanbeh this place is being replaced by foreigners everywhere.

 

[Froggy]

Aha it just shows how successful PAP is able to attract talents, hey these or loctors ok not meimei ah.

We should increase this to 80% I think Indians and Chinese loctors all waiting.

:oIo: pap

 

[GOD IS MY DOG]

this Ah Neh doctor from India that i visited at Changi General Hospital ....................farking useless and lousy attitude.........


he said '' i don't know what's wrong with you................so there's nothing wrong with you''

 

[Cruxx]

Aha it just shows how successful PAP is able to attract talents, hey these or loctors ok not meimei ah.

We should increase this to 80% I think Indians and Chinese loctors all waiting.

:oIo: pap

Yah. PAPpies thinking of importing 华陀 because some senile, babbling old fool thinks Sinkies are lazy, daft and untalented.

 

[yuelao]

i'm sorry but what's wrong with having so many foreign doctors (if they are fully qualified)? are you trying to protect the turf of local doctors so they can charge us astronomical consultation fees?

You CB traitor. The question you should be asking is "Why are we not able to train enough local doctors?". Is that a profession shunned by Sinkies and we need to import foreigners to do the job too? :oIo:

In all likelihood, Sinkandpoor has again gone for the cheapest solution to import foreigners trained elsewhere for an instant solution just like the sports talent scheme.

 

[bryanlim1972]

You CB traitor. The question you should be asking is "Why are we not able to train enough local doctors?". Is that a profession shunned by Sinkies and we need to import foreigners to do the job too? :oIo:

In all likelihood, Sinkandpoor has again gone for the cheapest solution to import foreigners trained elsewhere for an instant solution just like the sports talent scheme.

the answer probably lies in poor planning for the surge in resident population. and now, its too late to ramp up the number of training places available. along the way, they discovered its cheaper to import than to train.

importing doctors and paying them less will make medical care more affordable. singaporean doctors all want to be specialist and plastic surgeons, hence the lack of GPs. all this is conjecture of course.

back to my point - so why are we defending the turf of doctors who easily make $250k/year? opening up the profession to competition from overseas doctors will help to keep costs low for the people.

don't be blind to some of the benefits of foreign labour. sure, we should not import all the china/india trash to work in service/IT - these jobs should be saved for singaporeans. but for professionals who can hold their own internationally, they should be subject to intense competition to keep costs low for the majority of singaporeans.

Monopolies in the professions only benefit the professionals.

 

[yuelao]

the answer probably lies in poor planning for the surge in resident population. and now, its too late to ramp up the number of training places available. along the way, they discovered its cheaper to import than to train.

importing doctors and paying them less will make medical care more affordable. singaporean doctors all want to be specialist and plastic surgeons, hence the lack of GPs. all this is conjecture of course.

back to my point - so why are we defending the turf of doctors who easily make $250k/year? opening up the profession to competition from overseas doctors will help to keep costs low for the people.

don't be blind to some of the benefits of foreign labour. sure, we should not import all the china/india trash to work in service/IT - these jobs should be saved for singaporeans. but for professionals who can hold their own internationally, they should be subject to intense competition to keep costs low for the majority of singaporeans.

Monopolies in the professions only benefit the professionals.

Now you are just stupid. Doctors as a profession is unlike a profession like IT. Why? Because it concerns lives. A wrong diagnosis may result in serious harm or death. For IT, the worst you usually get is a system crash for a few days.

Now, you may say that we can use accreditation to maintain standards. But who will be responsible for this accreditation? SMC? How do you set the criteria for accreditation? I don't mean to say that local doctors do not make mistakes and I certainly do not mean we should throw out all foreign doctors. What I want to put across is asking whether we are solving a problem with another problem because it is the cheapest solution.

Good doctors are in demand all over the world and will always command a minimum pay level as it is difficult to become a good doctor. So this destroys the argument that opening up to competition will lower the costs, not forgetting that the SMC is also there to safeguard the pay of doctors. All this does is to allow doctors of lower quality to flood the market to bring down costs. Same as saying since the peasants are complaining about high costs, we can bring that down but you will have to accept lower standards. Everyone can do this so why then is there a need to pay millions for people to set policies like these?

 

[aangsc]

Foreign nurse, teacher , cleaner , lawyer also can , why not doctor ? Only one club cannot for foreigner - as politician; must change to ink ic first.

 

[yuelao]

Foreign nurse, teacher , cleaner , lawyer also can , why not doctor ? Only one club cannot for foreigner - as politician; must change to ink ic first.

My position is clear. No job should be open to foreigners that easily, including jobs like cleaners, rubbish collectors, construction workers where Sinkies are said to shun. The problem of why Sinkies do not want these jobs must be addressed rather than simply importing foreigners for them. The basic underlying reason is that these jobs pay too little and the working conditions are taxing. In a place like Sinkandpoor, other Sinkies will be looking down on people working on these jobs. If these jobs pay a decent salary, it won't be that natural to look down on the workers doing these "dirty" jobs.

 

[lianbeng]

lianbeng says, "Singaporeans want to be doctors must study Medicine Faculty in NUS 1st and serve NS as MO 1st. so it's cheaper, faster, and better to "buy" FT doctors mah."

 

[ginfreely]

My position is clear. No job should be open to foreigners that easily, including jobs like cleaners, rubbish collectors, construction workers where Sinkies are said to shun. The problem of why Sinkies do not want these jobs must be addressed rather than simply importing foreigners for them. The basic underlying reason is that these jobs pay too little and the working conditions are taxing. In a place like Sinkandpoor, other Sinkies will be looking down on people working on these jobs. If these jobs pay a decent salary, it won't be that natural to look down on the workers doing these "dirty" jobs.

Yeah all jobs, especially plum jobs like doctor, lawyer etc should be reserved for Sporeans and not given to foreigners. If everything is so opened to foreigners, how to motivate and convince young Sporeans that they have a future in Spore? Plus i doubt these foreign doctors' skills and credentials, especially Pinoys, Indians, PRCs. Only small number should be given to foreigners, definitely should not be 60% go to foreigners!

 

[bryanlim1972]

Now you are just stupid. Doctors as a profession is unlike a profession like IT. Why? Because it concerns lives. A wrong diagnosis may result in serious harm or death. For IT, the worst you usually get is a system crash for a few days.

Now, you may say that we can use accreditation to maintain standards. But who will be responsible for this accreditation? SMC? How do you set the criteria for accreditation? I don't mean to say that local doctors do not make mistakes and I certainly do not mean we should throw out all foreign doctors. What I want to put across is asking whether we are solving a problem with another problem because it is the cheapest solution.

Good doctors are in demand all over the world and will always command a minimum pay level as it is difficult to become a good doctor. So this destroys the argument that opening up to competition will lower the costs, not forgetting that the SMC is also there to safeguard the pay of doctors. All this does is to allow doctors of lower quality to flood the market to bring down costs. Same as saying since the peasants are complaining about high costs, we can bring that down but you will have to accept lower standards. Everyone can do this so why then is there a need to pay millions for people to set policies like these?

you are being retarded, because you cannot distinguish between the issue of admitting foreign doctors to reduce cost and meet demand, and the issue of quality of doctors.

doctors cannot freely practice anyway they desire, their qualifications may not be recognized in that particular country.

and you shoot yourself in the foot, u say SMC is there to safeguard pay of doctors - so that's exactly why we should import foreign doctors because that will lower local doctor's pay and lower health costs. consultation fees form a big chunk of medical expenses.

the problem isn't admitting foreign doctors, its admitting lesser qualified doctors. and this is the fault of the SMC or hospitals or whoever is in charge of quality control.

the policy is sound. the main implication of your argument to shut the doors to foreign doctors is substantially higher medical care costs.

 

[mako65]

Too many hospitals coming up soon and yet too few docs to fill in! MOH likes to recruit "ready-made" docs from China and India now and these foreign doctors are assisted by local nurses just in case they dun understand the dialects of our locals! To be frank, lampah govt shld open up more slots for local med students in the med faculty!

 

[bryanlim1972]

Yeah all jobs, especially plum jobs like doctor, lawyer etc should be reserved for Sporeans and not given to foreigners. If everything is so opened to foreigners, how to motivate and convince young Sporeans that they have a future in Spore? Plus i doubt these foreign doctors' skills and credentials, especially Pinoys, Indians, PRCs. Only small number should be given to foreigners, definitely should not be 60% go to foreigners!

your logic is all upside down. All "plum" jobs should be open to foreign competition - only 1-2% of each cohort of boys and girls end up as doctors or lawyers. these are already amongst the elite, and you want to protect them further???

its all the other IT/services/manufactuering/chupalang jobs that should be protected, precisely because no one wants to do it AT A LOW WAGE. hence you "protect" these jobs (reduce foreign supply) and force salaries to go up to make it more attractive to the other 98% of each cohort of boys and girls.

 

[bryanlim1972]

Too many hospitals coming up soon and yet too few docs to fill in! MOH likes to recruit "ready-made" docs from China and India now and these foreign doctors are assisted by local nurses just in case they dun understand the dialects of our locals! To be frank, lampah govt shld open up more slots for local med students in the med faculty!

this is obviously a problem of poor planning by Prime minister's office. with so many ministers based there, its a shock they couldn't coordinate the various ministries to deal with the surge in immigrants.

anyway the only solution they have is to import in the short term, it takes 6+ years to train a new doctor.

 

[ginfreely]

your logic is all upside down. All "plum" jobs should be open to foreign competition - only 1-2% of each cohort of boys and girls end up as doctors or lawyers. these are already amongst the elite, and you want to protect them further???

its all the other IT/services/manufactuering/chupalang jobs that should be protected, precisely because no one wants to do it AT A LOW WAGE. hence you "protect" these jobs (reduce foreign supply) and force salaries to go up to make it more attractive to the other 98% of each cohort of boys and girls.

Well I not doctor/lawyer, but I'll still be very sad if all the plum or so called elite jobs go to foreigners. What can the young, talented Sporeans look forward to like that? That does not mean that the other jobs need not be protected, as I said earlier, all jobs should be reserved for Singaporeans.