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CHC case - most costly criminal case in Singapore

Agoraphobic

Alfrescian
Loyal
I never bothered about this City Harvest Case. I figured the people's monies were given willingly, and they were legal-aged adults who did what they did knowingly. Most of them were "intelligent" professionals too! And where the criminal charges were concerned, well, its in the hands of the legal system. Well, now this legal case looks set to take the title of the republic's most expensive criminal proceedings! Not bad for the lawyers eh?

Cheers!


http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/...ial-most-costly-criminal-trial-singapore.html

City Harvest trial: Most costly criminal trial in Singapore?
Danson Cheong, The Straits Times/ANN | W

The City Harvest trial could go down as the most expensive criminal trial in Singapore's history.After 141 days in court, all six defendants - including the church's founding pastor Kong Hee - were found guilty on Wednesday of varying counts of criminal breach of trust and falsifying accounts.Senior lawyers The Straits Times spoke to said it would not be surprising if costs exceeded $2 million for each of the five defendants still being represented by lawyers. Four of these five are represented by Senior Counsel, regarded as the elite in the legal profession here, who can charge upwards of $1,000 an hour, said lawyers.The remaining defendant, former church fund manager Chew Eng Han, has represented himself since May last year. Previously, he was represented by Senior Counsel Michael Khoo.The defendants' lawyers declined to comment.Chew, however, told The Straits Times that he had paid $1.1 million in legal fees so far. Of this, $400,000 came from a fund to which church members contributed, he said.Put together, legal costs for the trial could shoot beyond $10 million, which would make it the most expensive criminal legal battle here, said experts.The figure does not include the bail posted by each accused, which ranges from $750,000 to $1 million."It has been a very extensive and long trial that would require intensive preparation over a long period of time. So the legal fees would be quite substantial," said Senior Counsel Lok Vi Ming.Other costly criminal battles include that of former Central Narcotics Bureau chief Ng Boon Gay, who was acquitted of corruption in 2013. It was estimated then that the trial could have cost over $1 million.The City Harvest trial is also one of the longest criminal trials on record, though still not as long as a drug trafficking trial that ran for 168 days in the 1990s.Veteran criminal lawyer Amolat Singh pointed out that with four Senior Counsel and their legal teams, costs would mount quickly."Everyone on the team has billable hours," he said, adding that the complexity of the trial is another big factor.The prosecution alone called 14 witnesses and produced more than 1,400 documents."White-collar crime is always more complex than normal crime. For white-collar crime, you have so many angles, so many documents, so many vouchers - all these add to the complexity," said Mr Singh.However, another veteran lawyer, who declined to be named, said if the $2 million in costs were averaged over the length of the trial, it would work out to a daily rate of about $14,000.He said: "That's actually not unreasonable."Meanwhile, despite the fact that in 2012, the Commissioner of Charities had warned the church against raising funds to pay the legal fees of the accused, former and current church members said independent efforts to raise funds have persisted.Former member Nanz Chong-Komo, 46, said there were always "a lot of initiatives and encouragement" in church to help the defendants financially. She left the church in 2013.Another church member, a prominent local businessman who declined to be named, confirmed this, and said he had personally given "a little bit"."This is more like a love offering, it's not a church thing. The (defendants) never solicited donations. People give of their own free will," he said. (k)
 
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halsey02

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
The lawyers & the staff in the various firms must be thanking god for providing them with a church like CHC, that provided them with manna & wealth for their harvest are bountiful.....for they making tons of money, & more to come, as long as they keep on appealing.....
 
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NanoSpeed

Alfrescian
Loyal
The lawyers & the staff in the various firms must be thanking god for providing them with a church like CHC, that provided them with manna & wealth for their harvest are bountiful.....for they making tons of money, & more to come, as long as they keep on appealing.....

To be fair, even M. Ravi will charge more than a million for such a long and complicated trial. You need manpower, and the law firm can't live on just one case. If you take into account the preparation work and non-court hearing hours involved, it's not a lot of money.
 

tonychat

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
you give too much credit for sinkie adults..

by default , adult should be independent thinkers but i doubt sinkie adults can think independently like a real human being..

Sinkies only think independently within their boundaries of indoctrination, brainwashing and stupidity.
 

Agoraphobic

Alfrescian
Loyal
Way before this scandal was exposed, I had my doubts about the authenticity of CHC as a bona-fide Christian organization. A colleague of mine belonged to this church, and one day, he saw a palm frond at the back of my car (my wife is Roman Catholic, and the palm frond was from the church after mass on Palm Sunday), and he asked what is that, and what was it for? It then occurred to me, that him being a Christian, was unaware of the meaning of the palm? What kind of Christian was he then? I told him it was from my wife's church, and did not elaborate further, concluding to myself that CHC was not interested in Christian (and Jesus Christ's) history and events. Whatever interests it had, had little to do with the tenets of Christianity. All that mattered to them was - success, materialism. I am glad what is happening now, just feel a little sorry for their followers who've been conned.

Cheers!

The lawyers & the staff in the various firms must be thanking god for providing them with a church like CHC, that provided them with manna & wealth for their harvest are bountiful.....for they making tons of money, & more to come, as long as they keep on appealing.....
 

Agoraphobic

Alfrescian
Loyal
Those of us who aren't lawyers seem to dislike lawyers. But looking at professionals now, I think they are the smartest bunch of buggers. Bloody hell, when I was in secondary school, my parents only wanted me to get into science stream, which I did, and then studied engineering! Fuck! It was difficult and at the end of that, working life is shit! Wishing I went to Arts and could have made it to law school.

Cheers!

To be fair, even M. Ravi will charge more than a million for such a long and complicated trial. You need manpower, and the law firm can't live on just one case. If you take into account the preparation work and non-court hearing hours involved, it's not a lot of money.
 

tonychat

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
Way before this scandal was exposed, I had my doubts about the authenticity of CHC as a bona-fide Christian organization. A colleague of mine belonged to this church, and one day, he saw a palm frond at the back of my car (my wife is Roman Catholic, and the palm frond was from the church after mass on Palm Sunday), and he asked what is that, and what was it for? It then occurred to me, that him being a Christian, was unaware of the meaning of the palm? What kind of Christian was he then? I told him it was from my wife's church, and did not elaborate further, concluding to myself that CHC was not interested in Christian (and Jesus Christ's) history and events. Whatever interests it had, had little to do with the tenets of Christianity. All that mattered to them was - success, materialism. I am glad what is happening now, just feel a little sorry for their followers who've been conned.

Cheers!

yup..many friends of mine who are from real churches do not behave like CHC church goers.

I know a lady friend from my study days who frequent CHC.. she behaves real bad without an ounce of wisdom at all. No patience and demanding.. i was wondering if you are so into church thing, why they fuck she behave like that.
 

Agoraphobic

Alfrescian
Loyal
In every society, people have to function within the constraints of their society. Singapore is too small for many things to happen and it is not right to compare with a big country like USA, or even UK. If one is a good musician in Singapore, what is one's prospect? (Within Singapore?) If one is a good athlete in Singapore, what is one's prospect? If one has a good brain say for rocketry, would one remain in Singapore? A lot is being done to promote innovativeness, out-of-the-box thinking, but at the end of the day, one has to make a living to support one's family. So people have to operate withing these boundaries, and Singapore, unfortunately is a little Peesai. Even if one wants to be career criminal (like Ralph Sonny Barger), you think there is scope for this to succeed in Peesai?

Cheers!

you give too much credit for sinkie adults..

by default , adult should be independent thinkers but i doubt sinkie adults can think independently like a real human being..

Sinkies only think independently within their boundaries of indoctrination, brainwashing and stupidity.
 

Narong Wongwan

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
yup..many friends of mine who are from real churches do not behave like CHC church goers.

I know a lady friend from my study days who frequent CHC.. she behaves real bad without an ounce of wisdom at all. No patience and demanding.. i was wondering if you are so into church thing, why they fuck she behave like that.
. I went along with friends to CHC and FCBC.....the service Machiam rock concert and many chiobus to beo.....and like going to disco....they keep asking you to pay cover charge.
I even went for cell meeting as I was courting a chiobu there....Kns Machiam tenple tangkee tiao tang....I thot wtf angmo pai Christians also like this same same with cheena bengs
 

Agoraphobic

Alfrescian
Loyal
I myself do not believe in religion, but believe in freedom of worship. CHC fills the void some people are looking for to belong to a group with a strong conviction, and support each other in this "belief." Kong Hee should have fled after amassing a few million instead of being so greedy and want unlimited wealth. Say if he made himself scarce after embezzling the church funds of a "modest" 5 ~ 7 million, he could still live comfortably in some place unknown to the rest of the world be free from the law, and "sin."

Cheers!

yup..many friends of mine who are from real churches do not behave like CHC church goers.

I know a lady friend from my study days who frequent CHC.. she behaves real bad without an ounce of wisdom at all. No patience and demanding.. i was wondering if you are so into church thing, why they fuck she behave like that.
 

NanoSpeed

Alfrescian
Loyal
Wishing I went to Arts and could have made it to law school.

Cheers!

Not everyone who studied law became a lawyer, and many who became lawyers ended up as beggars in People's Park and Chinatown.

If you are a natural aristocrat, you can study agriculture and you will still be very successful.
 

halsey02

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Way before this scandal was exposed, I had my doubts about the authenticity of CHC as a bona-fide Christian organization. A colleague of mine belonged to this church, and one day, he saw a palm frond at the back of my car (my wife is Roman Catholic, and the palm frond was from the church after mass on Palm Sunday), and he asked what is that, and what was it for? It then occurred to me, that him being a Christian, was unaware of the meaning of the palm? What kind of Christian was he then? I told him it was from my wife's church, and did not elaborate further, concluding to myself that CHC was not interested in Christian (and Jesus Christ's) history and events. Whatever interests it had, had little to do with the tenets of Christianity. All that mattered to them was - success, materialism. I am glad what is happening now, just feel a little sorry for their followers who've been conned.

Cheers!

Well, does your wife know the significant of PALM SUNDAY??....would you care to quiz her on that, before you criticise other? not that I support the believers of CHC? What does Palm Sunday represent??

I think you wife would not know either!...many just attend mass on Palm Sunday, get the PALM FROND blesses, bring it home & hang it over the door, hang at the altar...hang...at whatever where, thinking it will give them blessings till next PALM SUNDAY & get a new one.

PALM SUNDAY represent the triumphant entry of our Lord to Jerusalem, you go study the history of that time & the Bible before that event, you would know....it is also the fulfilment of the prophecy in Zech 9:9...even the Jews of the day, many didn't bother to know or didn't...they were looking for a king, with his troops. marching triumphantly into Jerusalem defeating the oppressors the ROMANS that were occupying their lands....they weren't looking for a KING on a donkey....

Your wife, no offence to you or her, most likely is just ignorant of PALM SUNDAY as that.....whoreshipper of CHC...best check your fingers, before you point...:wink:
 

NanoSpeed

Alfrescian
Loyal
Well, does your wife know the significant of PALM SUNDAY??....would you care to quiz her on that, before you criticise other? not that I support the believers of CHC? What does Palm Sunday represent??

I think you wife would not know either!...many just attend mass on Palm Sunday, get the PALM FROND blesses, bring it home & hang it over the door, hang at the altar...hang...at whatever where, thinking it will give them blessings till next PALM SUNDAY & get a new one.

PALM SUNDAY represent the triumphant entry of our Lord to Jerusalem, you go study the history of that time & the Bible before that event, you would know....it is also the fulfilment of the prophecy in Zech 9:9...even the Jews of the day, many didn't bother to know or didn't...they were looking for a king, with his troops. marching triumphantly into Jerusalem defeating the oppressors the ROMANS that were occupying their lands....they weren't looking for a KING on a donkey....

Your wife, no offence to you or her, most likely is just ignorant of PALM SUNDAY as that.....whoreshipper of CHC...best check your fingers, before you point...:wink:

According to Wiki, Christianity does not have exclusive copyright over this Palm thingy leh:

The palm branch is a symbol of victory, triumph, peace and eternal life originating in the ancient Near East and Mediterranean world. The palm (Phoenix) was sacred in Mesopotamian religions, and in ancient Egypt represented immortality. In Judaism, a closed frond of the date palm is part of the festival of Sukkot. A palm branch was awarded to victorious athletes in ancient Greece, and a palm frond or the tree itself is one of the most common attributes of Victory personified in ancient Rome.

In Christianity, the palm branch is associated particularly with Palm Sunday, when according to Christian tradition palm branches were waved at the triumphal entry of Jesus into Jerusalem. It was adopted into Christian iconography to represent the victory of martyrs, or the victory of the spirit over the flesh.

Since a victory signals an end to a conflict or competition, the palm developed into a symbol of peace, a meaning it can have in Islam,[1] where it is often associated with Paradise.
 

Agoraphobic

Alfrescian
Loyal
At the age where we were streamed (Sec 2), it is not possible to know what we'd become in our working lives, even in our adult working lives, things can and may change. In my case here, I went into Science Stream only because of parental expectations. Myself, I didn't like the subjects I had to study, and never envisioned what I'd do after school is completed, but our directions are somewhat directed by the subject we took, and I ended up in engineering, which in my working life, I hated. I am not inspired by factories, and their working conditions (noisy, dusty, hot, dangerous, oily) and always wished for a different environment. I eventually moved to sales, which although I am distanced from the actual engineering works, I am still involved in the industry. Unless one is in research and/or development/design work, it is not scientifically challenging, which again, if I were in the field, I still have no interest. During secondary school, it was prestigious to get into Science stream, and I suppose those who make it likely choose medicine, or engineering. That will be nice, if one likes it, but I didn't. Should have gone into Arts.

What we eventually do in life, as long as we contribute to society positively, is most important. For those of us who can, that is great, but for most others, as long as we stay out of trouble, raise our families, pay our taxes, that is the minimum we can do. More is obviously better. If you can sing, dance, or play games and get paid to do that, it is even better. The worst one can do is to cheat fellow humans, and by using the name of god, that is despicable. Live long and prosper!

Cheers!

Not everyone who studied law became a lawyer, and many who became lawyers ended up as beggars in People's Park and Chinatown.

If you are a natural aristocrat, you can study agriculture and you will still be very successful.
 

NanoSpeed

Alfrescian
Loyal
I myself do not believe in religion, but believe in freedom of worship.

Cheers!

Wow, bro you steady lah. You don't believe in religion, but you have been bestowed the authority to decide on who is a Christian or who is not, some more just by one Palm prong. :biggrin:

Christians sure squeeze their balls hard if they know their authenticity is not determined by Jesus himself, but by a non-believer. Steady lah !:p
 

Agoraphobic

Alfrescian
Loyal
I do not know how deep my wife's knowledge of Christianity is, and I do not question her about it either. Earlier in our acquaintance, I was open with her about my thought of Christianity and its inaccuracies and senseless beliefs (eg. Christ was born on Dec. 25, the story of creation and other biblical events, the chasms among the different churches), which did not deter her faith, so I left it as that, and she, on her part, did not coerce me to her faith. I take her to church and sometimes sit in with her. Through her (she does not socialize within her church with other members), I see that many Christians are tolerant, gentle, and are not self-centred. And this is what I see in them. I do not care about their saints, their preaching and events in the church's history.

Cheers!

Well, does your wife know the significant of PALM SUNDAY??....would you care to quiz her on that, before you criticise other? not that I support the believers of CHC? What does Palm Sunday represent??

I think you wife would not know either!...many just attend mass on Palm Sunday, get the PALM FROND blesses, bring it home & hang it over the door, hang at the altar...hang...at whatever where, thinking it will give them blessings till next PALM SUNDAY & get a new one.

PALM SUNDAY represent the triumphant entry of our Lord to Jerusalem, you go study the history of that time & the Bible before that event, you would know....it is also the fulfilment of the prophecy in Zech 9:9...even the Jews of the day, many didn't bother to know or didn't...they were looking for a king, with his troops. marching triumphantly into Jerusalem defeating the oppressors the ROMANS that were occupying their lands....they weren't looking for a KING on a donkey....

Your wife, no offence to you or her, most likely is just ignorant of PALM SUNDAY as that.....whoreshipper of CHC...best check your fingers, before you point...:wink:
 

Agoraphobic

Alfrescian
Loyal
There have been numerous threads in the religious forum on these subjects, and arguments from different angles have been quite thoroughly presented. Among Christians, there will be different views on who is and who isn't a Christian. To some, being a Christian means being baptised, belonging to a parish, attending mass, and adherence to certain tenets. To yet some others, following the teachings Jesus, being forgiving, suffices to be a Christian. They can be quite a mixed lot. Best seen in the different Christian groups who settled in the United States, where eventually, the federal judiciary proposed "Separation of State and Church" to lessen the confusion caused by their different teachings.

I am no authority on theology, but I have an opinion.

Cheers!

Wow, bro you steady lah. You don't believe in religion, but you have been bestowed the authority to decide on who is a Christian or who is not, some more just by one Palm prong. :biggrin:

Christians sure squeeze their balls hard if they know their authenticity is not determined by Jesus himself, but by a non-believer. Steady lah !:p
 

Jah_rastafar_I

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Well, does your wife know the significant of PALM SUNDAY??....would you care to quiz her on that, before you criticise other? not that I support the believers of CHC? What does Palm Sunday represent??

I think you wife would not know either!...many just attend mass on Palm Sunday, get the PALM FROND blesses, bring it home & hang it over the door, hang at the altar...hang...at whatever where, thinking it will give them blessings till next PALM SUNDAY & get a new one.

PALM SUNDAY represent the triumphant entry of our Lord to Jerusalem, you go study the history of that time & the Bible before that event, you would know....it is also the fulfilment of the prophecy in Zech 9:9...even the Jews of the day, many didn't bother to know or didn't...they were looking for a king, with his troops. marching triumphantly into Jerusalem defeating the oppressors the ROMANS that were occupying their lands....they weren't looking for a KING on a donkey....

Your wife, no offence to you or her, most likely is just ignorant of PALM SUNDAY as that.....whoreshipper of CHC...best check your fingers, before you point...:wink:


He got pawned
 

harimau

Alfrescian
Loyal
Once you gave your money to God, you cannot feel lugi if the people handling the money in the wrong way.

Otherwise you would still think that money belongs to you and still have attachment to them.

That is no good! This kinds of things should settle in the church and not bring out to a secular government to solve.

They will make things worse and defame the name of God.
 

NanoSpeed

Alfrescian
Loyal
I am no authority on theology, but I have an opinion.

Nobody is disputing your right to an opinion. You can have an opinion on anything; the crux of the matter is whether your opinion is persuasive at all.

It just so amusing that the authenticity of a Christian is determined by a non-Christian. It's like someone who himself does not believe in Christianity telling a Christian the correct way to practicing the Christian faith. It's not even theology; it's just common sense.

You appreciate that your freedom to have an opinion and whether you're qualified to give an opinion are two different species altogether.
 
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