https://www.facebook.com/Vivian.Balakrishnan.Sg?fref=ts
Aaron Loy
Bukit Panjang Hawker Centre & Market:
$320 – Service & Conservancy Charge
$500 – Table Cleaning Fee
$850 – Dishwashing Fee
Total of $1670, or more accurately, $1786.90, with GST.
Subject to change, but will it go down?
Not expecting it to be free,
but why are the fees so high? The amount is probably more than the pay of a worker with additional employee CPF contribution.
Is NTUC hiring an individual cleaner for each stall?
Do private coffeeshops, if they have outsourced centralised cleaning, charge $1444.50 (not inclusive of S&CC) per stall for the service? Would probably expect it to be about $500+-/month. Those with actual experience, do comment of course.
This is on top of the agreed upon rent of course. So, if the rent is $1, they'll still need to pay $1786.90 + $1 = $1787.90.
I've got quotes for Jurong East and Pandan Valley coffeshop stall rentals for $1000-$1800, one even includes utilities. To be fair, they're not at a centralised hub like where the BPHC&M is, but those numbers does put the 'effective rent', which is rent + fees, into some perspective. Perhaps a better comparison would be the rental values for the 2 competing coffeeshops right beside BPHC&M. Any concrete numbers would be nice.
Vivian Balakrishnan
Thanks Aaron.
Manpower costs have certainly gone up, partly because we introduce Progressive Wages for ckeaners. Cleaners must be paid at least $1,000 or more. Hawker assistants will also be paid more. I think that is fair.
Hawkers and the managers of hawker centres must therefore try to achieve economies of scale and improve productivity. I expect NTUC to reduce these rates wherever possible,
and to return any surplus back to the hawkers or use it to improve the centre. I also want rentals to come down as much as possible - and that has been the reason for the policy changes. I also agree that we should try to provide as much data about the costs of operation as possible.
The bottom line is that we are trying to achieve a balance between all the different stakeholders whilst keeping prices affordable. Will be open to calibrating the policies further to achieve this difficult balance. Thanks for sharing your ideas.
Aaron Loy
Transparency on the side of NTUC would help of course, especially since this is supposed to be operated
as a non-profit. Expecting them to do something is always different from them actually executing that something.
For example,
my assumption is that they're not going to hire 1 worker for each stall, which is part of the reason why it makes
the charge illogically high. But then if they are, they ought to let people know. Or if they're offsetting some of the costs of having people run that place through those fees (shouldn't that be S&CC though)? Or are they accumulating a surplus at the beginning for the proverbial rainy day? If so, up to how much? etc.
This government has lost the trust of its people - through its own merits. All your colleagues
inability to communicate properly only exacerbates the situation. Naturally, a government controlled union (
talk about conflicting interests, lol) would also be implicated in the mistrust.
It's time to gain back their trust.
Vivian Balakrishnan
With due respect,
I don't think the government has lost the trust of our people. Nevertheless, you know that I am a believer in giving as much data as possible so that people with different ideas can participate in generating solutions. I do hope you know me well enough by now.
Aaron Loy
Then with all due respect -
the irony in your belief is that that's the reason why the govt's support is in steady decline. I guess the confidence might be naively reassuring to some,
but please, wake up.
Ignorance may be bliss, but in this case, ignorance means slowly, steadily, handing over the control of Singapore to buffoons.
Then you have to honestly ask yourself where does this confidence come from.
Remember the emperor's new clothes. I'm respectfully telling you that you're naked right now.
I guess the B- score of the govt now is not an F, but it surely is worst than the A of the govt in the past. You want to wait until the F score comes before realising "oh dear.. We did lose it".
At least you're not going what your colleagues are doing, which is blaming the examiner for the lower score. Or I hope so. (Social media, etc, are force multipliers, not cause.)
As for giving the numbers, simply highlighting the fact that many pay low rent isn't enough. Not mentioning the fees doesn't provide the whole picture. "Hey some may pay rents as low as $10!" On top of the $1777.90 (w/GST) lah, right.
Not a good way to get trust.
Re: knowing you. I do. Or I try to at least lol. That's why I'm grateful that we can come here and have candid conversations.
Your sincerity and humbleness helps too. Many of your colleagues
have that as a mask, thankfully that's not the case for you.
Gabriel Khoo
No more reply.. Full stop here? Very interesting conversation.
Aaron Loy
He's a busy man.
They need to remember they're naked, but we also shouldn't be too quick to judge.
Wilfred NG
Dear Minister Vivian,
If data provided by Aaron Loy is correct,
I am pretty sure NTUC or operators of the hawker centre is over charging.
My question is what is the profit margin NTUC or other operators will need to make to be of decent amount?
In a hawker centre, how many table cleaners, dishwashers, general cleaners, equipments cost, etc.. are needed? You plus up all these costing and divided it with the number of stalls in a hawker centre, you will fully understand
why I said it is grossly over charging.
Linda Teo
Feeling blessed that we have Minister who really care for our people. The cleaning jobs are really tough issues as one can't expect local people to do the tasks at low wages(even higer wages little attract any one) and the nation can't load in cheap foreign labour which will have other issues like space for accommodation and their cultural issues.
The whole nation should brainstorm for ourselves. The clearing away the dishes that we had eat is a good existing on going idea. Maybe wet wipes should be available for us to clean up ourselves for the next user. Maybe dish wash machines can help in the future. Let's work together and be united. Cheers!
