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China Has $1.5 Trillion 'Hidden' Debt'.

GoFlyKiteNow

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China Has $1.5 Trillion 'Hidden' Debt: Lawmaker
Published: Friday, 14 Jan 2011 | 6:22 AM ET CNBC

Billions of dollars of debt racked up by local Chinese governments during their investment sprees are likely to sour as the projects they finance near completion, Yin Zhongqing, a prominent Chinese lawmaker, said this week.

In an interview with Reuters Insider, Yin said local governments had incurred at least 10 trillion yuan ($1.5 trillion) of "hidden" debt, which they have concealed by creating thousands of investment vehicles that serve as borrowers.

Yin said it is not yet clear which loans will sour because they do not have to be repaid until the projects are completed.

"The large amount of debt that local governments took on since the end of 2008 to battle the impact of the global financial crisis will become a heavy burden for our development going forward," said Yin, who is a member of the finance and economic affairs committee in China's parliament.

He highlighted the high risk of default in the low-level county governments, which Yin said have little financial resources.

"Seventy percent of the loans from these investment and financing platforms in 2009 and 2010 were generated at the county level, where governments don't have much assets, and some cannot even afford to pay their staff," he said.

"Debts accumulated from these platforms, even with government financial guarantees, simply cannot be paid back. In other words, when they borrowed the money, local governments did not plan to pay it back."

Local Chinese governments are barred by law from borrowing directly. To pay for their ambitious growth plans for cities, they set up investment vehicles that take out bank loans backed by assets - typically land - or implicit government guarantees. They do not show up in official central government debt accounts.

But Yin said these debts will ultimately have to be written off by Chinese banks and Beijing. "In 2009 and 2010, we encouraged them (local governments) to increase debt and run deficits to stimulate investment. Local governments' debt problems will come to light in 2011," Yin said.

He said local Chinese governments were still pursuing breakneck growth rates despite pleas from Beijing to slow down to let the economy tread a more steady and sustainable path.

"We need to use macro controls to pull it back and lower it to a reasonable level," Yin said.

While the problem of "hidden" debt among local governments is not new to China, its massive three-year stimulus programme in the wake of the 2008 financial crisis exacerbated the issue.

China's bank regulator estimated last year that local governments have racked up 7.66 trillion yuan in debt as of June 2010, of which 26 percent is unlikely to be repaid.

But the regulator put a brave face on the problem by saying the risks are under control since most loans can eventually be repaid using income earned from their investment. It also said banks are well protected against defaults because they have already set aside adequate provisions.

Yin warned against complacency, however, and said China's debt ratio was much higher than what official data suggests.

Beijing has said its fiscal deficit will fall below 2.2 percent of gross domestic product (GDP) in 2010, while its total debt will be less than 20 percent of GDP.

"China's rapid development has covered up many problems. But once economic growth slows down, these problems will emerge as stones rise when water levels fall," Yin said.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/41071922
 

Dreamer1

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This has been calculated by Northwastern U's Professor Victor Shin many years ago,but apprently the genral public has gone on the familiar line;

But CHINA is different!

Personally this is one major factor that I am worried about PRC's economy!

China's Hidden Debt Risks 2012 Crisis, Northwestern's Shih Says ...2 Mar 2010 ... China's hidden borrowing may push government debt to 96 percent of gross ... crisis in the world's third-biggest economy, Professor Victor Shih said. ... By Shih's count, China's debt may reach 39.838 trillion yuan ($5.8 ...


www.businessweek.com
 

longbow

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US has about $2.6 Trillion in muni debt. It also has $16 Trillion in household debt! And $8 Trillion in Treasuries (issued).

http://www.investinginbonds.com/marketataglance.asp?catid=31

The $1.5T figure may seem like a lot but take into account that there has been a lot of infrastructure build up within these cities. Power plants, water treatment, hospitals, airports, roads, etc. If you look at current state of development - from 3rd world i to 1st world infra it does cost money and behind each debt is a piece of infrastructure.

I am sure there is a lot of wastage but much of it is your basic city roads, police station, schools - that kind of stuff. Even if we were to say that 50% of that $1.5T is bad, note that Beijing's reserves are at $3T!

On top of that the citizens have no debt and save 56% of their income. Given the growth of the country and ensuing rise in wages, this pile of potentially taxable revenue stream is huge.

If you look at India, its debt situation is even worse especially given that it needs hundreds of billions in infrastrucre development. Chinese companies are offering financing in exchange for getting the jobs to build this infra.

Currently India runs a large budget deficit just trying to subsidize food (so no $ to pay for this infrastructure). But what it does is it borrows the $ from Indian citizens who are buy Indian Gov debt. That is how Indian Gov can run the high deficits with little outside impact. Kind of like Japan with 200% debt to GDP - its citizens buy Jap Giv bonds!

In China's case, Central Gov has huge reserves, it is beginning to form a strong tax base.

If you look at Singapore in the 1960s when it underwent that same build up of infrastructure, roads, sewerage, power plants, housing we likely ramp up a high level of debt too.
 

Coolsaint77

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US has about $2.6 Trillion in muni debt. It also has $16 Trillion in household debt! And $8 Trillion in Treasuries (issued).

http://www.investinginbonds.com/marketataglance.asp?catid=31

The $1.5T figure may seem like a lot but take into account that there has been a lot of infrastructure build up within these cities. Power plants, water treatment, hospitals, airports, roads, etc. If you look at current state of development - from 3rd world i to 1st world infra it does cost money and behind each debt is a piece of infrastructure.

I am sure there is a lot of wastage but much of it is your basic city roads, police station, schools - that kind of stuff. Even if we were to say that 50% of that $1.5T is bad, note that Beijing's reserves are at $3T!

On top of that the citizens have no debt and save 56% of their income. Given the growth of the country and ensuing rise in wages, this pile of potentially taxable revenue stream is huge.

If you look at India, its debt situation is even worse especially given that it needs hundreds of billions in infrastrucre development. Chinese companies are offering financing in exchange for getting the jobs to build this infra.

Currently India runs a large budget deficit just trying to subsidize food (so no $ to pay for this infrastructure). But what it does is it borrows the $ from Indian citizens who are buy Indian Gov debt. That is how Indian Gov can run the high deficits with little outside impact. Kind of like Japan with 200% debt to GDP - its citizens buy Jap Giv bonds!

In China's case, Central Gov has huge reserves, it is beginning to form a strong tax base.

If you look at Singapore in the 1960s when it underwent that same build up of infrastructure, roads, sewerage, power plants, housing we likely ramp up a high level of debt too.

True. Thanks for your enlightenment.
Bad debt itself is not necessarily bad, as long as the country can withstand it. But if i were the Chinese govt, i would be selective in which banks i would bail out. Let the rest failed. Afterall, i'm sure lotsa greedy dumbo foreign institutions would have put their money in these banks. So why not let the foreigners subsidise a little bit. Singapore subsidised Citibank investors wad.
 

Dreamer1

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I was suitably impressed by the latest HSBC prediction,World economy 2050

HSBC prediction-2050 GDP(in constant 2000 USD)
1.China 24.6 trillion
2.USA 22.3 trillion
3.India 8.2 trillion
4.Japan
5.Germany
6.UK 3.6 trillion
7.Brazil
4 muslim countries in the top 20
Turkey,Egypt, Malaysia and Indonesia will all move into the top 20.

HSBC predicts that the world's economic output will triple again by 2050, provided the major states can avoid conflict - trade wars, or worse - and defeat the Malthusian threat of food and water limits.
Growth will rise to 3pc on average, up from 2pc over the last decade.
Americans will be three times richer than the Chinese in 2050.
America's high fertility rate (2.1) will allow it too keep adding manpower long after China's workforce has begun to contract in 2020s and as even India starts to age in the 2040s
As superpowers of world food output, the US and Canada are sitting pretty

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...ina-and-America-leading-global-mega-boom.html
 

Dreamer1

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www.businessweek.com/.../china-s-hidden-debt-risks-2012-crisis-northwestern-s-shih-says.html


(Bloomberg) -- China’s hidden borrowing may push government debt to 96 percent of gross domestic product next year, increasing the risk of a financial crisis in the world’s third-biggest economy, Professor Victor Shih said.

“The worst case is a pretty large-scale financial crisis around 2012,” said Shih, a political economist at Northwestern University in Evanston, Illinois, who spent months researching borrowing transactions by about 8,000 local-government entities. “The slowdown would last at least two years and maybe longer,” the author of the book “Factions and Finance in China” said in a phone interview March 1.

Surging borrowing by local-government entities, uncounted in official estimates of China’s debt-to-GDP ratio, is the key reason for Shih’s concern. Harvard University Professor Kenneth Rogoff said Feb. 23 that a debt-fueled bubble in China may trigger a regional recession within a decade, while hedge-fund manager James Chanos has predicted a Chinese slump after excessive property investment.

By Shih’s count, China’s debt may reach 39.838 trillion yuan ($5.8 trillion) next year. His forecast for debt-to-GDP compares with an International Monetary Fund estimate for China of 22 percent this year, which excludes local-government liabilities. The IMF sees Spain at 69.6 percent, the U.S. at 94 percent, Greece at 115 percent and Japan at 227 percent.

Chinese officials allowed lending to explode from late 2008 to fight off the effects of the global financial crisis. In 2009, new loans rose to a record 9.59 trillion yuan ($1.4 trillion).

Asset Bubbles

Now, amid the risks of asset bubbles, soured loans and resurgent inflation, officials are reining in credit growth.

One focus of concern is lending to the investment companies set up by local governments to circumvent regulations that prevent them borrowing directly. Shih estimates that, already, borrowing by such entities may result in bad loans of up to 3 trillion yuan ($439 billion).

China’s banking regulator has ordered lenders to review loans granted to local governments’ financing vehicles by the end of June and ensure they can be repaid, a person with knowledge of the matter said in January. The China Banking Regulatory Commission is concerned that a few cities and counties may face very large repayment pressures in coming years because of debt ratios already exceeding 400 percent, the person said. The ratio is of year-end outstanding debt to annual disposable fiscal income.

‘Wave’ of Bad Loans

Local-government entities may have had a total of 11.429 trillion yuan in outstanding debt by the end of last year, according to Shih. They have agreed credit lines with banks for an additional 12.767 trillion yuan, said Shih.

A crackdown on local-government borrowing could trigger a “gigantic wave” of bad loans as projects are left without funding, while a failure to rein in lending could lead to inflation of over 15 percent by 2012, Shih said. Either situation could trigger bank runs and a crisis as people lose confidence in the financial system, he said.

UBS AG economist Wang Tao said China won’t face a debt crisis because national savings and government assets mean that the country will be able to finance its liabilities.

China’s mounting debt may hamper policy makers’ ability to maintain “many more years of high growth through stimulus, and slash growth to between 5 and 7 percent annually over the next decade,” said Michael Pettis, former head of emerging markets at Bear Stearns Cos. That’s “still healthy but much lower than the more than 10 percent growth rates of the past decade,” Pettis said.

‘Grinding Down’ Debt

In the fourth quarter of 2009, the Chinese economy grew 10.7 percent from a year earlier.

The economy faces “a slow grinding down of all this debt and there’s no easy way out,” Beijing-based Pettis, a finance professor at Peking University, said in a Feb. 24 interview.

China plans to keep its debt ratio within 20 percent of GDP, the Hong Kong-based Wen Wei Po newspaper reported Jan. 24, citing Yin Zhongqing, the deputy director of the National People’s Congress Finance and Economic Affairs Committee.

Shih arrived at his debt estimate after sifting through reports from more than 1,000 sources including regulatory filings, bond rating agencies, local-government Web sites and newspapers, he said. Besides adding local-government debt, he included bad loans in state-owned banks and liabilities held by development banks, asset-management companies and the Ministry of Railways.

China’s banking regulator is concerned that some local governments’ financing vehicles have used loans to pay taxes or buy property or shares, used money for purposes not approved by banks, or put cash into projects with no capital, cash flow or guarantees, the person with knowledge of the matter said.

The regulator has urged banks to stop lending to projects that are only guaranteed by local governments and wants loans to industries with overcapacity to be repaid as soon as possible, the person said.
 

GoFlyKiteNow

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Loyal
This has been calculated by Northwastern U's Professor Victor Shin many years ago,but apprently the genral public has gone on the familiar line;

But CHINA is different!

Personally this is one major factor that I am worried about PRC's economy!

China's Hidden Debt Risks 2012 Crisis, Northwestern's Shih Says ...2 Mar 2010 ... China's hidden borrowing may push government debt to 96 percent of gross ... crisis in the world's third-biggest economy, Professor Victor Shih said. ... By Shih's count, China's debt may reach 39.838 trillion yuan ($5.8 ...


www.businessweek.com

According to a Guotai Junan Securities research report, the 2010 fund gap, i.e. capital invested but not recovered, for the real estate industry will surpass 1 trillion yuan, doubling the sum of mid- and long-term loans in 2007, when the industry reached its peak. On average, the fund gap for every developer will be accounting for 24% of sales revenue last year.

China’s problem today is in some ways the opposite of Japan. One might refer to it an excess liquidity trap. It has 3 dimensions, all of which present serious policy dilemmas:

China has to be concerned that excess domestic liquidity will cause economic overheating, but is afraid to raise interest rates for fear that it would slow employment growth, generate additional non-performing loans in the banking system.

China cannot continue to sterilize large amounts of excess liquidity in the banking system indefinitely without risking a qualitative deterioration of PBoC’s balance sheet

It is difficult to protect the value of China’s foreign exchange reserves against dollar decline precisely because the dollar’s share in those reserves are large.

China has lost substantial amount of its reserves due to the dollar value decline and Euro volatility. Both currencies were used by China to hold its reserves. There are no other alternative currencies to move to other than to its own, which would instantly trigger huge inflation within the country.
.
 

Dreamer1

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Not surprising,Brazil is seen to be in a panic

Trade war looming, warns Brazil
By Jonathan Wheatley and Joe Leahy in São Paulo

Published: January 9 2011 21:30 | Last updated: January 10 2011 00:02

Brazil has warned that the world is on course for a full-blown “trade war” as it stepped up its rhetoric against exchange rate manipulation.

Guido Mantega, finance minister, told the Financial Times that Brazil was preparing new measures to prevent further appreciation of its currency, the real, and would raise the issue of exchange-rate manipulation at the World Trade Organisation and other global bodies. He said the US and China were among the worst offenders.

“This is a currency war that is turning into a trade war,” Mr Mantega said in his first exclusive interview since Dilma Rousseff, Brazil’s new president, took office on January 1. His comments follow interventions in currency markets by Brazil, Chile and Peru last week and recent sharp rises in the Australian dollar, the Swiss franc and other currencies amid an exodus of investment from the sluggish economies of the US and Europe.

The actions have renewed interest in how to manage destabilising flows of speculative money, with the International Monetary Fund suggesting last week that the world needed rules to govern the use of capital controls.

Mr Mantega, finance minister since 2006, coined the term “currency war” in September before launching controls on foreign portfolio investments in Brazil aimed at stemming an increase of 39 per cent in the real against the dollar over the past two years. He said that most of Brazil’s measures last year were directed at the spot market but the focus had switched to the futures markets, which he said were now behind the upward pressure on the currency.

On Thursday, Brazil’s central bank launched a surprise measure to curb short selling of the dollar against the real by onshore banks. “You can expect more measures on the futures market,” he said.

He said currency manipulation would be on the G20 agenda this year. Brazil would also lobby to have the WTO define exchange-rate manipulation as a form of veiled export subsidy.

Any attempt to change WTO rules to incorporate exchange rates would be difficult, however, as China could be expected to veto it, analysts said.

Mr Mantega said that Brazil’s trade with the US had slipped from an annual surplus of about $15bn (£9.6bn) in Brazil’s favour to a deficit of $6bn since the US began trying to reflate its economy through loose monetary policy.

He said China’s undervalued currency was also distorting world trade. “We have excellent trade relations with China ... But there are some problems ... Of course we would like to see a revaluation of the renminbi
 
Last edited:

Dreamer1

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Chile joins currency war to help exporters
By Daniel Schweimler in Buenos Aires

Published: January 4 2011 17:54 | Last updated: January 4 2011 17:54

Chile is set to become the latest country to join the “global currency wars” on Tuesday after the central bank said it would spend up to $12bn this year to curb the peso’s strength and so help exporters from one of Latin America’s most open and best managed economies.

The move, announced late on Monday after the peso rose to nearly a three-year high against the dollar, took markets by surprise as Chile’s central bank is known for its hands-off approach to its free-floating exchange rate.

The peso weakened by about 4 per cent on Tuesday as the news sunk in that the central bank would spend $50m a day from today selling pesos. Equivalent, in total, to 6 per cent of gross domestic product, the programme is the biggest intervention in Chile’s history and only its fourth since 1999.
Felipe Larraín, Chile’s finance minister, said: “We are supporting domestic producers, our exporters, in the farm as well as industrial sectors who depend on exchange rates. We think it is a well targeted step that is going to have an effect on the exchange rate.”

However, the central bank said the main reason for the move was to build up a cushion of international reserves equivalent to 17 per cent of GDP to protect Chile from possible repercussions from the eurozone’s sovereign debt crisis, continuing ultra-low international interest rates and the depreciation of the dollar.

“The availability of additional reserves will allow a better handling of any major deterioration of the global outlook,” it added.

Mexico is now the only big Latin American economy not seeking to weaken its currency via intervention, or by putting in place controls on capital inflows such as Brazil’s 6 per cent tax on bond inflows.

Meanwhile, in emerging Europe, Turkey is considering cutting rates in an attempt to stem excessive capital inflows, a paradoxical move given it is also likely to be one of this year’s fastest-growing economies. Indeed, some analysts feared that the surprise move by Chile could open the way for further unorthodox policies in other emerging markets.

“If the pretty conservative Chilean central bank intervenes, what can you expect of the Brazilian central bank?” asked Pedro Tuesta, senior Latin America economist at researchers 4Cast Inc.

Others, however, played down the regional impact of Chile’s move.

“Chile is just the latest domino to fall into intervention,” said Tony Volpone, head of emerging markets research for the Americas at Nomura. “I don’t think it changes others’ attitudes as they are already intervening.”

Chile is expected to grow 6 per cent this year, boosted by exports of copper, which hit a record high of $9,754 a tonne on Tuesday, but analysts said its new intervention policy meant the central bank would probably pause when it next met on January 13 from raising interest rates again.

Chilean rates currently stand at 3.25 per cent, versus forecast inflation of about 3.3 per cent. But higher rates would only encourage capital inflows and further exchange rate appreciation.

Additional reporting by Reuters
 

GoFlyKiteNow

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Loyal
I was suitably impressed by the latest HSBC prediction,World economy 2050

HSBC prediction-2050 GDP(in constant 2000 USD)
1.China 24.6 trillion
2.USA 22.3 trillion
3.India 8.2 trillion
4.Japan
5.Germany
6.UK 3.6 trillion
7.Brazil
4 muslim countries in the top 20
Turkey,Egypt, Malaysia and Indonesia will all move into the top 20.

HSBC predicts that the world's economic output will triple again by 2050, provided the major states can avoid conflict - trade wars, or worse - and defeat the Malthusian threat of food and water limits.
Growth will rise to 3pc on average, up from 2pc over the last decade.
Americans will be three times richer than the Chinese in 2050.
America's high fertility rate (2.1) will allow it too keep adding manpower long after China's workforce has begun to contract in 2020s and as even India starts to age in the 2040s
As superpowers of world food output, the US and Canada are sitting pretty

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...ina-and-America-leading-global-mega-boom.html

I have often seen such reports which project global economic scenarios for 2030, 2050 and so on. While forecasting even six months ahead ( in this era of internet age) is considered hazardous now a days, it is hilarious and incredible that there are experts in the financial sector doing just that. And they collect millions of dollars bonuses for their " incredible" insight and work.

BUT, apart from these soothsayers and their predictions 30 to 40 years ahead, there are some nagging questions which remain unanswered.

Take a look at the table you posted. Many such tables float around the net and media , each following the other in typical pack mentality pattern.

The SUM of all the parts cannot be bigger than the whole.
That being the case, as per the above table, China and India together
will surpass the USA GDP by over 8 Trillion dollars.

Now, if the US GDP is X dollars in 2050, then the dollars in supply will not be more than this X amount. YET, we see exactly that as per these predictions, wherein China and India together will surpass this X figure by 8 trillion !.

Oh.., we have not added the GDP of the other countries in the table. Japan, Russia, Brazil, 4 Muslim nations and so on. Well, we can wonder about that on another day !!!.
.
 

Dreamer1

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Loyal
I have often seen such reports which project global economic scenarios for 2030, 2050 and so on. While forecasting even six months ahead ( in this era of internet age) is considered hazardous now a days, it is hilarious and incredible that there are experts in the financial sector doing just that. And they collect millions of dollars bonuses for their " incredible" insight and work.

BUT, apart from these soothsayers and their predictions 30 to 40 years ahead, there are some nagging questions which remain unanswered.

Take a look at the table you posted. Many such tables float around the net and media , each following the other in typical pack mentality pattern.

The SUM of all the parts cannot be bigger than the whole.
That being the case, as per the above table, China and India together
will surpass the USA GDP by over 8 Trillion dollars.

Now, if the US GDP is X dollars in 2050, then the dollars in supply will not be more than this X amount. YET, we see exactly that as per these predictions, wherein China and India together will surpass this X figure by 8 trillion !.

Oh.., we have not added the GDP of the other countries in the table. Japan, Russia, Brazil, 4 Muslim nations and so on. Well, we can wonder about that on another day !!!.
.
If things work out well,by 2050,there might be a currency union by G2,group of two,and that would be the world currency.

Never in the world history that u have such a close,and complementary one & two.It is a natural union,except that No.1 does not like No.2,and no.2 has lifelong ambition to beat no.1
 

longbow

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Biggest difficulty is the exact timeline. Take case of China. I have seen figures of between 10 (PWC) to 20 years for China GDP to become larger than that of the US. That is a broad spread and it reflects the variance of data.

But from a macro picture, US is a fully developed country and most fully developed nations grow at between 2 to 4 percent. Anything faster and they have widespread inflation. So you see US growing at 2 to 3 percent and China moving at between 8 to 10 percent and you can plot point of intersection. Fact is that even when China's GDP overtakes the US, its economy is still that of a 3rd world nation; its per capita will only be 1/5 that of the US. Sounds really 3rd world to me.

So at the point of intersection with US GDP, China will still continue to grow at 7 to 8%. Just imagine the amount of economic input needed to upgrade the countries infrastructure to that of a 1st world nation. Trillions and Trillions of $ and all that expenditure will mean a high GDP for many years to come. After all China has 5 times US population with a land mass as large as the US.

India wll also follow the same rapid growth. But they are about 10 to 15 years behind that of China in terms of its economy. It needs to follow the same things that China did - attract foreign investments, build huge mfg base and infras, life worker's wages, etc etc. High tech alone is not going to lift the 800 million from poverty. In a way the big disadvantge with India is lack of overseas Indians running factories.

While China was in the deep freeze in the late 70s, Taiwan, HK and to a lessr extent Singapore were already major mfg powerhouses. HK had the garment and financial sector and taiwan had the plastics and electronics. So when China opened up, there was no lack of talent and $. Taiwanese, Hkgers and Singaporeans (GIC-suzhou) rushed in to tap the cheap labor and started many of the factories. These 3 countries were savvy exporters and knew exactly what the US and EU wanted. So they just transplanted their knowledge and $ into China.

Unfortunately, India lacks this overseas dispora. Most of the Indians overseas are the cream of the crop. They immigrated to UK, US and are now doctors, engineers, corp management, few started factories.



I have often seen such reports which project global economic scenarios for 2030, 2050 and so on. While forecasting even six months ahead ( in this era of internet age) is considered hazardous now a days, it is hilarious and incredible that there are experts in the financial sector doing just that. And they collect millions of dollars bonuses for their " incredible" insight and work.

BUT, apart from these soothsayers and their predictions 30 to 40 years ahead, there are some nagging questions which remain unanswered.

Take a look at the table you posted. Many such tables float around the net and media , each following the other in typical pack mentality pattern.

The SUM of all the parts cannot be bigger than the whole.
That being the case, as per the above table, China and India together
will surpass the USA GDP by over 8 Trillion dollars.

Now, if the US GDP is X dollars in 2050, then the dollars in supply will not be more than this X amount. YET, we see exactly that as per these predictions, wherein China and India together will surpass this X figure by 8 trillion !.

Oh.., we have not added the GDP of the other countries in the table. Japan, Russia, Brazil, 4 Muslim nations and so on. Well, we can wonder about that on another day !!!.
.
 

GoFlyKiteNow

Alfrescian
Loyal
If things work out well,by 2050,there might be a currency union by G2,group of two,and that would be the world currency.

Never in the world history that u have such a close,and complementary one & two.It is a natural union,except that No.1 does not like No.2,and no.2 has lifelong ambition to beat no.1

Yes, I know,..by 2050, there maybe a world currency...
I deliberately avoided mentioning that in my last post to avoid making the
reply post too long and lose focus.

Now..about this 2050 global currency..even you have qualified your statement..

1...If things work out well.
2. There might be currency union
3. that would be world currency.

So, all the above pre conditions may have nothing to do with economics, GDP and economic growth..or is it ?.
Probably it has more to do with geo-politics, convergence of nations with common political ideologies into groups ( The western powers and Japan ( G7 ) are already on this platform - sharing open democratic government value systems. And a lot of other factors..which have nothing to do with ECONOMICS.

Then who are these financial forecasters and wonder kids, earning millions of dollars in bonus and salary who write such prediction reports ?. What is their merit, knowledge and standing vis a vis such matters ?

What qualifies them to write such reports and to be admired or taken
seriously by the rest of the pack / herd and the media and the public ?
.
 

theDoors

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Loyal
Went to a talk given at NTU yesterday regarding rise of China.

The speaker a professor from JFK school of public policy is very confident that Chinese economic growth will not be indefinite. A slow down might possibly trigger unrest.
 

theDoors

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Loyal
Yes, I know,..by 2050, there maybe a world currency...
I deliberately avoided mentioning that in my last post to avoid making the
reply post too long and lose focus.

Now..about this 2050 global currency..even you have qualified your statement..

1...If things work out well.
2. There might be currency union
3. that would be world currency.

So, all the above pre conditions may have nothing to do with economics, GDP and economic growth..or is it ?.
Probably it has more to do with geo-politics, convergence of nations with common political ideologies into groups ( The western powers and Japan ( G7 ) are already on this platform - sharing open democratic government value systems. And a lot of other factors..which have nothing to do with ECONOMICS.

Then who are these financial forecasters and wonder kids, earning millions of dollars in bonus and salary who write such prediction reports ?. What is their merit, knowledge and standing vis a vis such matters ?

What qualifies them to write such reports and to be admired or taken
seriously by the rest of the pack / herd and the media and the public ?
.

closed door banker boys club?
 
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