a fall of the dragonhead at tg pagar grc soon

[yellowarse]

so tjs left sdp becos of an internal power struggle which csj refused to give way? does that mean that csj is still hogging the rein even though he can't accomplish anything much?

Wouldn't call it a power struggle. TJS knew that at his age he had at most one more election to go and he wanted to head the party. He didn't want to wait. On the other hand CSJ, being much younger, felt that he could lead the party for another term or two before handing over the reins.

So TJS left, on amicable terms. If you remember, SDP lent logistic and manpower support to TJS during PE2011.

 

[tanwahp]

SDP lent logistic and manpower support to TJS during PE2011.

To be specific, SDP members helped out TJS and TKL in their personal capacities. SDP didn't issue a decree to lend resource to any candidate, just that many SDP members naturally helped TJS because he was part of the party. CSJ also wanted to support TKL in a way as he had supported SDP in some events, so he asked some others in SDP to support TKL. That is why SDP members were seen in both camps.

 

[tanwahp]

Wouldn't call it a power struggle. TJS knew that at his age he had at most one more election to go and he wanted to head the party. He didn't want to wait. On the other hand CSJ, being much younger, felt that he could lead the party for another term or two before handing over the reins.

There is always the option that TJS serve as chairman and CSJ continue to serve as SG. The fact that this option didn't pan out showed that there was more to it than the question of who leads. Both probably foresaw that their approach would be different and may even clash.

 

[yellowarse]

There is always the option that TJS serve as chairman and CSJ continue to serve as SG. The fact that this option didn't pan out showed that there was more to it than the question of who leads. Both probably foresaw that their approach would be different and may even clash.

TJS specifically wanted the SG position, nothing else.

In Jan this year, he made a similar offer to KJ: KJ as chairman of RP, TJS as SG plus AYG and Nicole in CEC. KJ refused. KJ later approached TCB. And TJS set up SF.

 

[leetahbar]

as can be seen, they are already mini-tyrants in the making. maybe that's the way politic works.

the fall of the dragonhead shall initiate the weakening of the pap which could be even more sinister and ruthless in "fixing" the ppl beside the opps.

during the old guards days, there was no problem returning us our cpfs. but now, the impression is THEY SHALL NEVER WANNA RETURN US our savings.

probably the next national fix would be to increase the GST to 10%. there's absolutely NO WAY pap giving out freebies so willingly. behind all such freebies, there is sure a bigger pap moneymaking waiting to milk everyone dry. that's the real intentional pinky quote: NO ONE SHALL BE LEFT BEHIND.

 

[tanwahp]

TJS specifically wanted the SG position, nothing else.

Then CSJ as chairman is still possible. Let's face it, we have seen such jostling at those small committees, clan associations and management councils. Ultimately, the repeated scenario that the bigger determining factor is how much influence you wield which is based on the kind of person and leader you are.

GMS was an example of a "empty shell SG". He probably had the biggest say in areas the other NSP CEC didn't care about, such as material of flag holders or colour of posters.

In Jan this year, he made a similar offer to KJ: KJ as chairman of RP, TJS as SG plus AYG and Nicole in CEC. KJ refused. KJ later approached TCB. And TJS set up SF.

Nicole back at RP sounds absurd but the group probably didn't have high expectations that it would happen.

 

[krafty]

did you see their political chess move recently, tjs is equipping himself with recognition from ivy league universities in the US.

 

[yellowarse]

Then CSJ as chairman is still possible.

Theoretical possibility. But CSJ said NO. And I don't foresee CSJ letting go of the SG position for the next 2 elections.

 

[leetahbar]

Theoretical possibility. But CSJ said NO. And I don't foresee CSJ letting go of the SG position for the next 2 elections.

can we agree that tjs = csj's mini-me?

 

[leetahbar]

tg pagar grc especially queenstown is a weak ward ruled by backdoor mp chia shih lu who is busier checking bones than checking voters.

 

[tanwahp]

Theoretical possibility. But CSJ said NO. And I don't foresee CSJ letting go of the SG position for the next 2 elections.

Self-overvaluation has always been an obstacle to building of bigger parties. When you are at a level, so will your party. I am not talking about opposition unity, which is only one way to building a bigger force.

 

[yellowarse]

can we agree that tjs = csj's mini-me?

No, they're very different. Each is his own man. The only thing they share is their left-wing libertarian idealism.

 

[leetahbar]

did you see their political chess move recently, tjs is equipping himself with recognition from ivy league universities in the US.

he should have gone to SANTA MARIA - holier than poison ivy.

 

[leetahbar]

No, they're very different. Each is his own man. The only thing they share is their left-wing libertarian idealism.

that one is quite dubious.

the behavioral manners of one powerless and later becum powerful could be a great difference and contradiction.

sometime the powerless is better remain powerless cos once powderful, he becums a sadistic tyrant which sadly there is streak in tjs and csj.

i hate to judge but this is a gut feeling which of course could be wrong since both in this lifetime can never be the powderful they hope and dying for.

 

[yellowarse]

sometime the powerless is better remain powerless cos once powderful, he becums a sadistic tyrant which sadly there is streak in tjs and csj.

You have judged wrongly. Both CSJ and TJS have strong convictions, but they're a far cry from sadistic tyrants.

CSJ is actually quite a democratic leader who makes decisions in consultation with his CEC and party members, and a good listener. He's also willing to take criticism when he's made a mistake. Some of the mistakes, e.g. PE BE, were actually the result of erroneous advice from party insiders. The only non-negotiable item is the succession issue.

TJS has a close inner circle whom he always consults ... even his campaign speeches and press releases are vetted by this group for comments and suggested revisions. He wants to lead, true, but everyone has a chance to air his/her views. His strong sense of mission – bordering on impatience sometimes – has to do with his age, the reality that he's got only one good election in him to make a strong impact.

 

[3_M]

tg pagar grc especially queenstown is a weak ward ruled by backdoor mp chia shih lu who is busier checking bones than checking voters.

Indranee and lily Neo are very popular and with the absences of opposition all these years, I think chances for opposition is very slim.

 

[zeebjii]

You have judged wrongly. Both CSJ and TJS have strong convictions, but they're a far cry from sadistic tyrants.

CSJ is actually quite a democratic leader who makes decisions in consultation with his CEC and party members, and a good listener. He's also willing to take criticism when he's made a mistake. Some of the mistakes, e.g. PE BE, were actually the result of erroneous advice from party insiders. The only non-negotiable item is the succession issue.

TJS has a close inner circle whom he always consults ... even his campaign speeches and press releases are vetted by this group for comments and suggested revisions. He wants to lead, true, but everyone has a chance to air his/her views. His strong sense of mission – bordering on impatience sometimes – has to do with his age, the reality that he's got only one good election in him to make a strong impact.

Strong conviction you say, but of what? For personal glory and power?

TJS has got only one good election and he will fail. Reality is being the attention-seeking person that he is, he will try and try again. First try after next GE failure is the next presidential election.

 

[yellowarse]

Strong conviction you say, but of what? For personal glory and power?

Political ideology. They're both left-wing libertarians.

Ideology is a foreign concept to most S'poreans, and most political parties here, the PAP included. But it is a lynchpin of politics in many other democracies.

 

[tanwahp]

Political ideology. They're both left-wing libertarians.

I don't think so. Left-wing libertarian is largely anarchist, ie belief in non-governance. Nothing in their manifesto states that. I would be worried if they were, since they are chasing something made irrelevant - people got over left-wing libertarian as early in Europe and America.

The parties will also disagree with you. Singfirst clearly states that it is a centrist party, while SDP had long positioned itself as social democrats.

 

[yellowarse]

Singfirst clearly states that it is a centrist party, while SDP had long positioned itself as social democrats.

'Social democrats' is code for left wing libertarian. Social = left-wing; democrats = libertarian.

(Of course, it's not extreme left-wing (commie) or extreme libertarianism (anarchism)).

As for SF, the 'centrist' positioning is just to tap into the middle-ground swing voters. Read their manifesto and you'll see that it's definitely left-wing economically (increased govt spending, minimum wage, govt intervention in land pricing, etc), but slightly more conservative politically than the SDP, e.g. it's silent on gay rights whereas the SDP has stated it supports the repeal of S377A. Both parties affirm support for the political freedoms of assembly, association and speech and have unequivocally condemned the use of ISA to silence political dissension.