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What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the GE

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

You could be right. There is a distinct difference between politics and policies.
Tan Jay Say economic proposal and SDP medical restructuring is A+. Too bad, the heartlanders crowd lack foresight, wisdom and guts. They are more happy to hear candidates scolding PAP
 

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

That has always been his problem.
TJS is too "cheem" for the heartlanders....... if he wants to connect with them he gotta come down to their level.
 

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

It is really an important point. The moment people rich or poor , educated or uneducated have a sniff of sectarian or special interest agenda they are immediately put. They stopped listening thereafter.

It doesn't matter to me whether VW or SDP declare that they will not advance a gay agenda if they get into parliament.

I have nothing against gays and their preferred lifestyles, but the moment they start rallying for their rights or promoting their lifestyles, my interest in them as professionals is lost. Again, it doesn't matter whether it's in private or public time.
.
 

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Both Alec and Soh Lung have come to that realisation. Just talk to their friends. The moment I saw his votes I too was taken aback. Then you JJ Yee from WP which no one had heard of.
They played by the book this time but the SDP name is so far dragged intot he m&d that the mere mention of it makes votes well turn off.
 

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

They had little choice. In view of past problems with SDP on seat allocations, the other parties do not give much quarter. They and SDA were left with the dregs.

I think they did well for a first try although I wouldn't contest holland bukit timah GRC...
 

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Not in a million years. Completely incompatible. There is also more to this than meets the eye. Interestingly it is not Chee that is the issue but the associates and friends.

What is slightly less implausible is an NSP-SDP alliance.



But things that make sense in singapore opposition politics rarely happen.

haha
 

Rimururu

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Chee has changed for the better, but his past hangs a shadow over the SDP. Hence, when people see SDP, people still think "Maniac Party".
 

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Agree. Especially the Chiam See Tong affair. If he had done it to JBJ it would not have been an issue. You are also right that there is no link with aspirations of the ordinary people in Singapore.

Yet they do not realise it. Everytime a video is released about their hotel celebrations, people start to wonder. If the million dollar ministers in PAP would not be caught in swanky outfits in party event. SDP still do not realise why PAP wears white with short sleeves and no tie and why WP wear blue coloured t shirt.
One main factor that lost them votes is being under the SDP banner and their association with CSJ. To his supporters, it has to be said and it is brutal. CSJ has a stigma and anyone associated with him will be tainted. Whatever he did in the past is going to haunt and dogged his footsteps and it would be best for him to seek a different career or work behind the scenes. His diehard supporters may have the impression that CSJ personifies the aspirations of the ordinary folks and he is well-received by many but the reality is, he is not. Truly a harsh POV but sometimes one needs to be brutally frank.
 

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Agree with some observations about their budget. Anyone with half decent education would have caught them out.

Teo Soh Lung is looking for closure for what had happened to her and was detached from the entire GE.


SDP just too greedy. They should have sent all their candidates to fight in SMCs instead of trying to be on par with WP and NSP by trying to take on GRC's.

I didn't find their Manifesto nor 10 pledges compelling at all. In fact, the 10 pledges made me worry that these SDP candidates are MP-wannabe's on cheap sale!

I found VW to be a sneaky fella from the day he appeared on TV and touting the SDP Shadow Budget to Tharman. Even if Tharman didn't smile, the rest of the civil service staffers who worked on national budgetting were certainly laughing like crazy at his audacity!. I told myself then, "this snotty bastard will bring the party down with his ego trips". And when the gay issue came up, my mind was made up. SDP doomed again!

TJS and AYG looked like 2 retrenched 'used car salesmen' indeed. They were both shouting angrily every time they were on stage with TJS often saying "10 billion dollar" without the 's'. I was convinced that this guy obviously not fit to be MP with his thug like mannerisms.Wonder how he lasted with GCT, making $300K a year as his PPS!

Ang Yong Guan is a joker and I cannot see him as MP material too, esp given his penchant for talking hokkien like Ah Beng soldiers and I often wondered if he knows anything about politics. He portrayed himself like someone giving lectures on "stress management to NSF recruits".

Michelle Lee looked like a pretty face more than a politician. Yes, she had good scripts to read during the rallies. But these were often recycled materials that didnt make her 'stand out'. For someone with a degree from London School of Economics and ex-MAS experience, she hardly offered any views on our Economic model from a global perspective or challenges arising from a rising China or India.

Teo Soh Lung??...should have just retired long ago. Listen to her for 3 minutes and you can switch off!

Gomez, as usual became a pain with "Operation JB" remarks about Khaw Boon Wan. He can disagree with the adequacy of our health policies on meeting the needs of the citizens. But to say derogatory things like "banishing him to JB"of all places really made him look like someone who is uncouth and unfit for office as an MP.

SDP really needs to do some soul searching on how it portrays itself to the electorate...otherwise it will have to be contented with the 30% that traditionally vote against the PAP, regardless of who is standing.

in fact.
 

RandomNexus

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

This is now the new buzz and questions are plenty. Here is the outcome of the breakfast session post GE.

As expected there were number of schools thought with some having some very strong positions. But first the background;

The team was made of Vincent Wijeyasingha, Tan Jee Say, Ang Yong Guan and Michelle Lee. Everyone one of them was amply qualified with sterling qualities and not one of them was a passenger in terms of some minority crap associated with GRC. They spoke well, they grabbed the attention of Singaporeans from day one and had an excellent logistical and social media support from SDP. Everyone of their formal and informal comunications went well even when compared to the Behemoth PAP. The presence of Prof Paul Tambyah from NUH and his excellent speech. What went wrong and terribly wrong as the margin was 20% when VB had a perception and popularity issue with YOG, homelessness and price of meals albatrosses hanging his neck.

3 strong school of thoughts

1) Holland-BT is where the rich, famous, and the movers and shakers reside. They may be 100% behind this team, see all the logic behind the arguments and may even be friends with them, but practically might have been a factor. These people traditionally really on access to power. They rely on the PAP to approve their development plans, their business models, the building approval plans with mansion, access driveways etc. They need a govt team in residence as their MP to get the approvals etc. Vincent and team are practically useless to them. These are not heartlanders. They are not your usual salaried staff. They know that Town councils are either non existent in their ward or meaningless.

2) SDP Banner - The worse performing in previous GEs and with a negative legacy of not connecting with the people. As one pundit expressed - "the moment Alec Tok returned such a poor result knowing his credentials, the writing was one the wall". In fact all the well regarded candidates who joined SDP but were not associated with SDP such as Teo Soh Lung performed badly. I understand that Ms Teo cried and was upset that she left for home with close confidants. It is common knowledge that SDP was not the first choice as a party and in 3 of the cases were turned down by other opposition parties. SDP saving grace was having RP who performed badly as expected but both SDP and RP were buoyed by negative sentiments against the PAP. In comparison, SPP in Bishen-TP did very well.

3) The Gay / Sex with Boys smear. They outing of VW plus the video with the idiotic Ravi must have taken its toll. It video became viral before and after VB comment. The social media backlash did not seem to have VB who already is not popular have clashed with PAP Lily Neo and with some many negatives. The religious / conservative might have dealt a significant blow.

So which school of thought prevails or is it a combination of a number of factors. These are however quite conclusive
- the best slate of opposition candidates of qualification and performance
- they did badly when you compare the fact that every single one of WP candidates out performed them including some NSP candidates facing string PAP wards with entrenched sr cabinet figures.

Bear in mind that the PAP strategy team felt that the seat was under threat that they removed Lim Swee Say from it. It left a PAP team that was not even sino-centric which is not the normal PAP model and something which falls as a cardinal sin in party politics.

Do note that Dr Chee and the SDP followed the book on political campaigning and communication and completely differed from usual and past ethos of confrontational and PAP centric messaging.

Bro Scro,

This team did pretty well actually especially the ability to garner votes from the upper and higher middle classes. To expect them to win after 9 days of compaigning in this ward is too much to ask.

The feedback in this thread is good as I read thru, and I just write my thoughts, but some of them are already mentioned.

1. A lot of damage has been done to SDP branding by the poor tactics of CSJ over the years. He is totally out of sync with Singaporeans. If he continues to follow this track, nothing will come out of it. First of all, PAP-led government, for all its faults, is not the totalitarian machine it is made out to be. Hence civil disobedience does not work when generally, many Singaporeans feel PAP has done a "good job" in governing. Nobody can dispute this fact at all.

2. No groundwork done by SDP at all in this constituency unlike WP's thorough preparations in the East and North East spanning over 10-15 years. All their candidates just drop into the wards without much of a groundwork. Again, you can't fool Singaporeans.

3. Candidates' credentials are good but on bread-and-butter issues, they could not appeal to the heartlanders at all. The results really show. They are candidates on a liberal bent. There is a need to appeal to Chinese-speaking masses.

4. Agreed with most forumers here that their public-speaking capabilities can be improved. Dr Ang sounds like a joker, and does not appear to be a serious politician. Tan Jee Say could improve further by appearing more like a stateman politician. He really sounded too serious as though he has an axe too grind. Michelle is pleasant but in one clip, she laughed far too much in her speech. Vincent W, is cut out to be like CSJ.

5. Fighting for gay rights - although SDP said they will not pursue one, nobody believes that is the case with Vincent W. He has openly stepped forward to be in a gay rights forum. This will be a black mark against him, and he has to work harder to change this image. Vincent W and CSJ are cut from the same cloth, and they are "angry" and want to right the wrongs they perceived in this country's system. The problem with their angst, is that it is a different type of anger felt by Singaporeans. They are not of sync. They need to change and ally with Singaporeans' sense of anger rather than their own. Fighting for fringe issues does not appeal to Singaporean masses and only appeal to fringe groups, and how to win votes?

6. Prof Paul Tambyah did what all those above did not do in just one speech - humble, light-mannered yet serious, hit at the right issues, great soundbites, highly narrative and his credentials backed up SDP did a lot but it came a bit too late, and not much effort was made to publicise it, and most folks I spoke to, are very impressed by his speech. I am curious why he endorse SDP to date as he would have known CSJ and his past antics. You need more folks like Paul Tamyah.

To do an image transformation takes a lot of time, and it is a difficult process. Most of these credible candidates joined SDP at the last minute as SDP offered them a platform to stand as candidates for this election. It is really a marriage of convenience if you are to look at it. For example, even James Gomez is likely booted out of WP, and he joined SDP. James Gomez only appeared during elections time, and this does not help. Look at SDP's indigenous candidates in Sembawang and they fared badly. SDP confrontational model will not bring votes to itself at this juncture of Singapore's political happening. So much damage has been done and I am surprised they are still at it. If they continue with this approach, I dare say Tan Jee Say and those recently joined, will probably leave this party. Will they be able co-opt this group? At some point there will be a clash if CSJ and his gang do not want to change. You can't adopt 2 styles and try to co-exist. It is schizophrenic. Better leave earlier and start your own party, and that would be my advice, or join another. But there are not many choices. It is either WP or NSP. The rest of the parties are not up to mark. It is far easier to create a new image than to rework the extensive damage that has already been done to SDP's brand.
 
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sylandro

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

. I understand that Ms Teo cried and was upset that she left for home with close confidants. .

bro, i dare not speak for your other comments but TSL never cry la.

halfway thru vote count she knew it was not in her favour she was already congratulating Grace Fu. I was there.

At best maybe is sore throat after all the KPKB thru the campaign.

She was chirpy throughout. The picture is not as grim as u paint it on the whole la.
 

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Bro, hope you don't mind. Have started a new thread for your post. It deserves a higher profile than be buried here.
Bro Scro,

This team did pretty well actually especially the ability to garner votes from the upper and higher middle classes. To expect them to win after 9 days of compaigning in this ward is too much to ask..
 

scroobal

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Fully agree on the Prof. A special individual.
6. Prof Paul Tambyah did what all those above did not do in just one speech - humble, light-mannered yet serious, hit at the right issues, great soundbites, highly narrative and his credentials backed up SDP did a lot but it came a bit too late, and not much effort was made to publicise it, and most folks I spoke to, are very impressed by his speech. I am curious why he endorse SDP to date as he would have known CSJ and his past antics. You need more folks like Paul Tamyah.

.
 

dysentry

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Interestingly, I see WP's sino-centric style as its weakness in capturing minority and english-speaking votes.

Much more needs to be done by WP if they want to go beyond one GRC, especially in recruiting Malay and Indian candidates.

They have impressed me with their organization and consistency in this campaign.

I see the baby steps of our alternative government.
 

Rimururu

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Interestingly, I see WP's sino-centric style as its weakness in capturing minority and english-speaking votes.

Much more needs to be done by WP if they want to go beyond one GRC, especially in recruiting Malay and Indian candidates.

They have impressed me with their organization and consistency in this campaign.

I see the baby steps of our alternative government.

I think Low had improved on that. The Aljunied GRC team consists of two minorities, one Singh and one Malay.
 

kukubird58

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

hahaha...is there a need for any more of these BS threads....
the team is doomed from day 1 when they elected to stand under SDP ticket...
 

kingrant

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Re: What went terribly wrong

I find that too simplistic an explanation. There were other factors like the other team members she has. She was the strongest member from NSP but her counterpart was not Tin Pei ling but GCT. Whatever she cld do better, she still wud not be able to claw down GCT's margin by too much. As a debuttante and newbie, Nicole's performance can be said to be very good already. If she had fought in a SMC, whatever she did wud have come up tops.

The thing is that if Nicole had stayed confident, smiles all the time, and had not pulled the crying trick, the NSP would have won Marine Parade GRC.

For her strained face, angry speeches, crying trick, they were reduced to a 17% vote swing. :(
 

leetahbah

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Teo Soh Lung??...should have just retired long ago. Listen to her for 3 minutes and you can switch off!

Teo Soh Lung don't have professionalism to thank voters after her loss. Being detained by ISD is not something that people sympathize with. Especially when that event is decades ago, people no longer talk about it. If nobody gives a shit about CSJ being repeated jailed, nobody will shit care about Teo Soh Lung and her ISD detention.

One other person I forgot, he gave quite an impression in his maiden speech.

Alec Tok - His speeches are always fiery, sounds angry and not smiling. To makes matter worse, he cut his hair like a Ah Beng. That hair style did cost him a lot of votes.
 

alphaville

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

What a dumb analysis...
1) Is totally wrong, Michelle Lee has stated that landed estate actually give them support, she eyeballed the count, duh.
2) SDP made significant inroad in terms of vote swing how's that suppose to have not been an improvement.
3) TNP very own survey indicated 76% does not mind the Gay factor, another duh.

The best analysis goes to Alex Au. 2nd prize goes to Singapore election blog, he had a survey asking if we should go on riot, spot on. :smile:
 

karmabear

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Re: What went terribly wrong in Holland-BT for the best qualified opposit team in the

Alec Tok .... he cut his hair like a Ah Beng. That hair style did cost him a lot of votes.

this I have to agree. He is like 40+, whats with the hair?
 
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