SDP will withdraw.

[tanwahp]

When you invite somebody you have good things to offer somebody. What does SDP have for WP? The possibility of not contesting in PE? And what does it have to offer WP if SDP insists on contesting and wants WP to get out? I don't think there is anything.

At the first press con SDP said they had the best candidate and was the best party with the best position. Surely no party who believes in that will give way to another party? They also said that they will enter the contest no matter what.

Unless they have problems crafting public statements which I doubt so, their position is summarized as this: the reason they want to meet is to ask WP to give way. But why is there a need to meet to pass that message? You can just email, or even go ahead without writing anything. It's not WP's ward. Why invite only WP and not RP and SDA. All these nagging questions were asked but SDP hasn't got an answer.

When you invite someone and you have nothing really concrete to offer, in common language that is not invite. That is summon. These people need to respect people before they can talk about governing people.

Agree. Inviting someone gives two options. If you want to give two options, then don't make one option look worse than the other. Otherwise, it's not an invite.

 

[metalmickey]

You just prove yourself wrong. In all these public figures you cited, all of them eventually show their true self, voluntarily or not. LTK is a known public figure in Singapore for two decades. He's recognized everywhere he goes. There is not a shred of evidence for more than two decades in spite of widespread availability of recording devices. Out of the blue right before a by election, an anonymous post on sammyboy says he is a racist, and you choose to believe. Are you that gullible?

... BTW, George bush II is not even close to ultra conservative. He raised taxes and run deficits. Being conservative does not mean being trigger happy. That requires stupidity.

I am not believing or unbelieving whether LTK is racist. As you can read for yourself elsewhere on this thread, I am still questioning his accuser. This is not the first charge of racism, if you can recall earlier there was the issue with Indian members and cadreship.

No matter how much you think that Low Thia Khiang achieved in his career, right now it is still very early for him. There is a Chinese saying hao xi hai zai hou tou - the best part hasn't been played out yet. You have still not seen the true colours. Wait until he actually speaks up in parliament, wait until you get him involved in policies involving race. Then we will have a better picture of his record. The lack of evidence that he is a racist is not the same as evidence that he is not a racist. I'm just saying - it's not impossible.

Another example - up till today historians are debating whether Hitler was secretly gay. They are speculating he executed a lot of gay people because he himself was ashamed of being gay. The point is that after all that's been said and done, we don't know everything about certain public figures.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexuality_of_Adolf_Hitler

George Bush 1 raised taxes. George Bush 2 cut them. He cut so many taxes, which is why the US govt is bankrupt.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_policy_of_the_George_W._Bush_administration

As a governor he was willing to work with Democrats. As a president, he cut them off. Or like the Chinese saying, you know the man, you know the face, but you don't know the heart.

 

[horsayliew]

.....

Vichy WP has withdrawn.

WP withdraws motion to debate town council issue in Parliament
http://www.asiaone.com/News/Latest+News/Singapore/Story/A1Story20130110-394555.html

"We have yet begun to fight."

.....

WP - AIM motion withdrawn to help PAP win the B/election

 

[SgParent]

A market is not a monopoly, a monopoly is not a duopoly, a duopoly is not full competition. When people talk about competition, it really means competing between many many people and not just two. I hope you're aware of that and not merely bluffing when you say you know economics.

So, more competition always always benefits the consumers, except when the competitor is SDP, except when there is a three corner fight, except when there is paralysis by analysis.

You have asked me to argue with you 10 times and 10 times I have refused because I do not argue with people who can use "always always" and "except" in the same sentence.

You could not ,dare not take up my challenge because you haven't even learned how to walk.

Tell me, do you think the SDP's latest tear jerking stunt causing more good or harm to Oppo cause?

 

[kukubird58]

hahaha...well said about all the baseless allegations..
but if the whistle blower is a respected and regarded member of this forum...how ah???

 

[metalmickey]

You could not ,dare not take up my challenge because you haven't even learned how to walk.

Tell me, do you think the SDP's latest tear jerking stunt causing more good or harm to Oppo cause?

Ha ha ha. This time I will say that more competition always always benefits the consumers. Except, of course, the consumers are not the opposition.

 

[SgParent]

This time I will say that more competition always always benefits the consumers. Except, of course, the consumers are not the opposition.

Are you saying SDP is competing with WP, and the White Scums benefit?

So the White Scums are paying for SDP (as a consumer)? Or what? You are not making sense. Or you are?

 

[metalmickey]

Are you saying SDP is competing with WP, and the White Scums benefit?

So the White Scums are paying for SDP (as a consumer)? Or what? You are not making sense. Or you are?

No you are the one not making sense. You are the one saying that "more competition always always benefits the consumers". Then this three corner fight comes along and you say "more competition does not benefit the opposition cause" which is irrelevant because you now switch the argument to the "opposition cause". Then suddenly I realise that you are saying that what is good for the opposition is good for the people, as though they are one and the same.

So now if I were to apply your favourite sentence, "more competition always always benefits the consumers" I suppose that would mean that the people of Punggol East would be happy that they have 3 people to choose from instead of two.

The PAP is the PAP, the WP is the WP, the SDP is the SDP, and the people are the people. So I ask you, who should benefit?

 

[SgParent]

No you are the one not making sense. You are the one saying that "more competition always always benefits the consumers". Then this three corner fight comes along and you say "more competition does not benefit the opposition cause" which is irrelevant because you now switch the argument to the "opposition cause". Then suddenly I realise that you are saying that what is good for the opposition is good for the people, as though they are one and the same.

So now if I were to apply your favourite sentence, "more competition always always benefits the consumers" I suppose that would mean that the people of Punggol East would be happy that they have 3 people to choose from instead of two.

The PAP is the PAP, the WP is the WP, the SDP is the SDP, and the people are the people. So I ask you, who should benefit?

As I'd suspected you are confused and needed extra guidance on learning to walk properly. That's why I asked you a much simpler question:
Do you think the SDP's latest tear jerking stunt causing more good or harm to Oppo cause?

Dun worry, I will reveal the rest of the questions and answers to you in due time. But you have to promise me that you will be patient and will not try to run again before I say so ok?

For now just answer that question. Take your time. You may call a friend, poll the audience, 50-50 or whatever.

 

[metalmickey]

I ask you again. Does competition always always benefit the consumer? And this time we are not in doubt that when we are talking about consumer, we mean the voters, not PAP, not SDP, not WP.

 

[yellowarse]

What makes you think I don't although I must admit I failed in Mandarin. But my Hokkien is lumber one.

Many years ago, people like yours truly were allowed to study Malay as a second language. As such, I am very fluent in Malay and proud of it. In fact, Malay, much to Low's dismay and annoyance, was taught to Chinese in schools as a national language subject.

As a Chinese, my small contribution to racial harmony is to stand up for the Malays and Indians against the "Guess the race" WP racists and bigots and against Chinese Chauvinism such as that held by Low Thia Khiang.

Thanks for your clarification. I've always thought you were a member of an ethnic minority, from Delfi days. Now I know where you're coming from.

 

[SgParent]

I ask you again. Does competition always always benefit the consumer? And this time we are not in doubt that when we are talking about consumer, we mean the voters, not PAP, not SDP, not WP.

Why do you still doubt competition always, always benefits the consumers?

So can we finally go back to my simple question to you?

 

[metalmickey]

Why do you still doubt competition always, always benefits the consumers?

And a 3 corner fight is more competition or less competition than a 2 corner fight?

 

[Tiu Kwang Yew]

Ponggol east voters are looking forward to see WP contesting the PAP.
4 to 5 corner fights will not bode well.

Most ponggol voters will think SDP is a PAP stooge if it contests, and others are just jealous of WP.

My friend, winning a GRC or Single ward by Oppo is never easy, there is no easy path to parliament.

Look at Nicole Seah, she knows what she is doing. Patience is the virtue ! This sweetie has a material to do big thing.

sdp should aim for bigger thing. Contesting PE and loses deposit will regress back to where it begins.

WP is doing the right thing at Aljunied GRC and Hougang. Politics in sinkapore is wierd and funny, and most voters do have less EQ, to add. You cannot play well, you lose.

WP wins Ponggol east will benefit all Oppo next GE.

Patience in sinkapore politics is a must.

 

[metalmickey]

My friend, winning a GRC or Single ward by Oppo is never easy, there is no easy path to parliament.

Look at Nicole Seah, she knows what she is doing. Patience is the virtue ! This sweetie has a material to do big thing.

sdp should aim for bigger thing. Contesting PE and loses deposit will regress back to where it begins.

WP wins Ponggol east will benefit all Oppo next GE.

Winning a single seat is easier than winning a GRC.

Nicole Seah can be patient and play the long term game, assuming she's going to stick around. As for Tan Jee Say, you can ask him Chen Show Mao's question, "how many 5 years do you have in your life?"

SDP can aim for big thing. But then again, if BE is a "small thing", how much can they lose from a BE? Maybe the SDP will throw away the BE for the opposition. On the other hand it is true that it will be bad for SDP if they lose their deposit, but I don't think that will happen.

WP winning PE will be good for WP and bad for all other opposition parties. It will put the opposition parties in a weaker bargaining position when it comes to cutting up the pork for 2016. WP will be fine without the PE seat. They will be busy enough. Maybe a few hundred thousand dollars poorer, that's all. I expect them to be very busy with without the PE seat.

 

[ray_of_hope]

On the other hand it is true that it will be bad for SDP if they lose their deposit, but I don't think that will happen.

Interesting. Let's see what actually happens.

 

[metalmickey]

When you invite somebody you have good things to offer somebody. What does SDP have for WP? The possibility of not contesting in PE? And what does it have to offer WP if SDP insists on contesting and wants WP to get out? I don't think there is anything.

When you invite someone and you have nothing really concrete to offer, in common language that is not invite. That is summon. These people need to respect people before they can talk about governing people.

I have another theory. (Sorry I have been having a lot of theories lately).

As we now know the WP did not respond to the invitation. If they badly wanted the SDP to withdraw, they would have said to the SDP - you fuck with me, I fuck with you. I have a lot of young people out there who need battleground training. If you contest Punggol East, I will make sure that every constituency you contest in 2016 will be a 3 cornered fight. I will fuck you into the ground.

But instead they did not respond. They just said nothing. No message is a message. That message is: we're not sure if we're going to win PE anyway. If you want to contest in BE, go ahead. If you kill yourself in the process it's not my fault. I'm not going to turn this into a screaming match.

 

[Fook Seng]

I think you have to compare

A: SDP just ownself go compete in BE
B: SDP go compete in BE but offered to talk to WP first.

If you want to borrow something, and you asked the guy, and even if the guy didn't respond and you take it, it is strictly not really borrowing, but at least it is not stealing either.

Both these two scenarios are the least probable of all the scenarios. Scenario A - WP has a bigger obligation to its 41% supporters than SDP to stand for election and it is extremely idealistic and, may I say, self-pointed to expect WP to move aside for SDP to stand alone.

Scenario B - I have already discussed in several threads. What is their bargaining chip?

Scenario A is possible but highly unrealistic. Scenario B is not possible because like me, WP probably nothing for them on the bargaining table.

A thief does not have to ask the owner whether he can take his things. Whether he wants to take it is his own problem. In legal terms, if there is 弄agreement from the owner, it is misappropriation. The one to judge will be the common people. It can be extremely contentious if WP polls some 5 to 10 % more votes than SDP and together their votes actually exceed the PAP's.

The ball is in the court of the SDP to make this decision.

 

[Fook Seng]

What makes you think I don't although I must admit I failed in Mandarin. But my Hokkien is lumber one.

As a Chinese, my small contribution to racial harmony is to stand up for the Malays and Indians against the "Guess the race" WP racists and bigots and against Chinese Chauvinism such as that held by Low Thia Khiang.

I sense a tint of inferiority complex here.

 

[rogerroger]

an additional seat does not make much of a difference and pap is going to win anyway. maybe we can relax and use this election to measure the support of each party. i think the results would be very interesting. i also hope that we can drop this idea of opposition unity once and for all. it creates a lot of unhelpful tension andjust isn't going to happen. different parties are for different groups of singaporeans.