Emigration - "The cowards never started and the weak died along the way."

[scroobal]

"The cowards never started and the weak died along the way." -anonymous



A very apt quotation to welcome people to this folder and Sam is spot on with it.

Its been 11 years with one Singapore focused forum began a dedicated forum on Emigration and I am sure it helped a generation to contemplate, plan and seek new pastures.

Many of us benefited from the move and there will be some who will think otherwise. However I am sure, its the kids that would have the opportunity to taste the full buffet spread of opportunities laid down for them in their new country.

On a personal front, I have noticed that emigration is not topical as it was in the past in Singapore. I wonder if its survival - no time for anything else but to focus on retaining the job, keep the business going, and fighting your way thru the crowd to make your way home.

Every time I travel, it just amazing that the number of people that I have met who have visited Singapore but have no intention of making Singapore their home. I am talking about 3rd world migrants from Singapore, PRC, Sri Lanka, India, even Africa who prefer to do a menial job than make Singapore home.

Emigrants broadly fall into 3 main categories
1) migrate for a brighter future for their families - middle aged families
2) migrate to retire in a serene or less expensive locale - retirees
3) migrate to pursue a career or seek out business opportunities - singles/couples

Though the Govt has not revealed much, Cat 1 was the biggest headache since the 70s. Usually undertaken by the English educated middle income families and teachers became the vocation category in this lot. Civil Servants made up Cat 2 by a mile and in the last 10 years, many retirees have begun moving to Malaysia, PRC, Thailand and Philippines to stretch the dollar.

Cat 3 is the single biggest challenge since the mid 90s and it is getting worse. There are push and pull factors at play. The push is what the kids are seeing at home and the pull is the amount of scholarship and opportunities for PR offered to graduating students to remain in their new country.

What potential category are you in and have you even attempted to make plans. The world is global and far more progressive than it was 30 years ago.

The concept of loyalty though not outdated works in equation where both the country and the people are on the same page, same platform and seeking the same outcome.

To the PAP - the holy grail is Singapore Inc and they have no qualms if it is driven by Filipinos, Indians from India, PRC Chinese or a quote from the grand old man of Singapore, a "swarthy mexican". Singapore's success is measured on its ability to routinely outstrip the quarterly GDP growth. People have become numbers and nation building stopped the moment Rajaratnam retired.

When asked about the sentiments on the ground, our previous PM and elder statesman prefer to indulge in semantics, side issues and feigning ignorance.

So what is the pull factor to remain in Singapore. Let me hazard a guess and I suspect it is the biggest one - the fear of failure. This generation has been conditioned to follow the template that any move away from the template might lead to failure.

Next post - Chasing the Dream.

 

[Ash007]

I would say I'm Cat 3. I came back in 2008 and never returned since. You are right about the fear of failure. But you forgot to mentioned another quote I heard. "The price of failure is too great in Singapore". Fail PSLE, sweep longkang. Fail O-level, go Poly be mechanic, etc etc. I think most Singaporean live under this fear of failure too much. I'm fortunate enough to study in Australia. I used to think, if you need to study in Australia, you are a failure as well for not being able to go NTU,NUS, mentality when I came. From this failure, I learned that being a failure and experiencing it means nothing. It actually broaden your mind more. Makes you stronger. I'm glad I failed the Singapore education system. If not I would still be stuck there. For those that are successful there, good luck to them. It takes different type of people to make this world. What works in Singapore, may not be suitable for everyone. I'm glad I realised that before it was too late.

 

[scroobal]

I agree - the fear of failure is commonplace and ingrained in one's psyche. People are no longer prepared to venture from the well beaten path. Its only when they are removed from the Singapore surrounds such as going away for studies or business that they start to seriously contemplate taking risk.

I am no longer what success means to a Singaporean anymore. See this post by a local and what he endured when he went to get his lunch

http://www.singsupplies.com/showthread.php?t=78836

im goin to the neighbourhood shopping mall to buy lunch and pay my bills.
i live on the 12 storey. i took a lift. on the way down, it stopped at 8, 6 and 5 storey.
incoming 2 pinoys and 1 prc couples. wow, didnt know there are increasing FT in my block.

the lift reached the ground level. i walked towards the traffic junction waiting to cross the road.
while waiting, i saw the ppl ard me are actually FT. u name it, u got it.
Worst, with their kids too. so they breed. omg.

finally the red light is up and i crossed the road. suddenly i realized i was in the centre of the FT crowd.
no way i can walk out of the crowd. i have to follow their pace and reached the other side of the road.

the crowd dispersed and i walked on the pavement. i tot walking on the pavement would be safe but NO NO.
im walking in fear and have to be alert. A bicycle appearing behind me without signal and warning,
he cut from my right into my path. first reaction, i have to stop or else i might get knock down and injured.
it will be a joke to claim my insurance on such accident.

i didnt know a 3 man path can become a 1 man path. funny. this FT family are so considerate, they walked in the centre
of the path. either you shout out the word excuse me or you walk pass them through the grass patch.
here comes another one, talking in the middle of the path, failed to realize dey are blocking the others.
omg, forget it. continue my walking. i reached the shopping mall. usually it took abt 10 min. Now i have to walk extra 10 min, to clear the obstacles.

haizzzz, i decided to pay my bills first. i tot im the second one in the row, how nice but I'm wrong.
this pinoy auntie was wif her kid wif a handful of bills in her hand. her kid was jumping ard like 1 monkey.
while she was scanning the bills, at the same time, she has to play the tug of war wif her kid.
i witness others beside me, few have already done wif their bills.
after the fun of waiting 15min, finally i got my bills paid and go buy lunch.

i waited again. ah neh ah neh, you pay $3 for the meal juz like anyone. can you pls stop asking watz this watz that,
wan to add this, wan to add that and hope the stall dun charge you? there is no freebies ok?
of course i know money is hard earned but tat is a fixed fishball mee, wat more u wan!!!
the Q gets longer juz becuz u dragging too long, did u realize?!?

i tabao mee kia dry and make my way home. i tot tings will end.
suddenly while i was walking, a little kid out of nowhere dashed out of the crowd into my path. I was caught by surprise
and came to a halt. I nearly knock into him. i took a look again. KNN, it is the same kid which was jumping ard juz nw.

halo FT, pls dun come and annnoy me can or not? i feel very disturbed and fustrated.
finally, i reached home. how sweet. finished my mee and switch on the desktop and write this.

Apologies, yes, this is a whine but im juz writing wat i have experienced and is happening.
__________________
We VS FTrash

I would say I'm Cat 3. I came back in 2008 and never returned since. You are right about the fear of failure. But you forgot to mentioned another quote I heard. "The price of failure is too great in Singapore".

 

[Ash007]

why he go out to tabao? After coming here, I've cooked more at home. Even my friends said I've been domesticated. Again, he sounds very whiny, one thing most people seem to forget about Singaporean is that they complain too much. Life is miserable when you look at all things in a negative perceptive. I sure was when I was back home.

 

[nayr69sg]

why he go out to tabao? After coming here, I've cooked more at home. Even my friends said I've been domesticated. Again, he sounds very whiny, one thing most people seem to forget about Singaporean is that they complain too much. Life is miserable when you look at all things in a negative perceptive. I sure was when I was back home.

Why did I migrate?

Well one day my cousin heard me complaing and said :

"Complain so much about Singapore.....you got basically 3 choices:

1) Join politics, join grassroots, go out and change things for the better. Do something about what you don't like and change it.

2) If you feel you cannot change the things in Singapore for whatever reason, then MIGRATE!

3) If you won't do 1) or 2) for whatever reason then SHUT UP!"

I thought about 1) long and hard and realized the problems in Singapore were fundamentally because it was too small. Nothing to do with the government.

So I decided to consider migrating.

Thank you cousin.

 

[neddy]

why he go out to tabao? After coming here, I've cooked more at home. Even my friends said I've been domesticated. Again, he sounds very whiny, one thing most people seem to forget about Singaporean is that they complain too much. Life is miserable when you look at all things in a negative perceptive. I sure was when I was back home.

Migration is also a downsize/rightsize choice.

I am also domesticated, I even make my own artisan bread. I have a fully auto breadmaker at home that wakes itself up at 1am in the morning to run through the 4 hr bread-making cycle. By 7am, I am able to use an electric knife to slice the bread and all I need is traditional butter to go with it, simple but luxurious (like my Jap mei mei calls it)
It is a "right-sizing lifestyle" choice to wake up to freshly bake bread twice weekly.

Breadmixes from http://www.allaboutbread.com.au/
I recommend Panasonic breadmaker, you need one with separate yeast dispenser and timer.
I usually make 750g bread, using 500g breadmix and 300ml of water (+/- 10ml for dry/humid weather)
Easy to clean up. No mess.

That reminds me, I need to order coffee-beans. For a change, I will order cleanskin.
http://www.fivesensescoffee.com.au/

 

[QXD]

I have reasons from Cat 1-3. After struggling as a new migrant trying to understand how things work. I honestly can say that I'm a happier person. Even my friends visiting me see the difference.

I sleep better, enjoy my kids growing up and pursue my simple hobbies.

Funny how Singaporeans think Oz taxes are too high and then turn on a dime to complain about prices going up all the time in SG.

 

[Leongsam]

Emigrants broadly fall into 3 main categories
1) migrate for a brighter future for their families - middle aged families
2) migrate to retire in a serene or less expensive locale - retirees
3) migrate to pursue a career or seek out business opportunities - singles/couples

There's a 4th category...the asset rich who cashed out while the going was good thanks mainly to the wonderful job the PAP performed of enhancing the asset value of the majority of Singaporeans.

They arrived in their adopted countries with a couple of million in the bank and have never had to do a stroke of real work since.

 

[fishbuff]

5th category - those that stood against PAP and eventually forced to leave. examples are francis seow, tan wah piao etc.

 

[Ash007]

5th category - those that stood against PAP and eventually forced to leave. examples are francis seow, tan wah piao etc.

Since you brought this up. The way GMS has been going, I suspect he is going to fall under this soon.

 

[bart12]

I have been a member from old Delphi forum since 1999 and still remember this quote vividly. I emigrated in 2001 and I was lucky to get a job offer before I landed. Since then everything is smooth sailing..What I cherish the most is the freedom and time to drive across this vast amount of land and enjoy some of the most stunning scenery mother nature can offer. If I have stayed in Spore, I believe I will definitely be driving a taxi criss-crossing Spore.

 

[scroobal]

There is one category that I know will never ever migrate is where the spouse has refused to even consider the move. Too many sob stories and I heard it all. I once had to sit down with a guy and his spouse over coffee to convince the lady that Angmos don't spit at asians on a daily basis in OZ.

I am not sure if anyone remember the lady who finally made it Melbourne who needed to convince her husband. So she got him signed up for SBF to soak up the atmosphere in the emigration folder. I recalled that she was running a business in Singapore but she needed a sponsor of some sort and she appealed in this forum and got one.

There's a 4th category...the asset rich who cashed out while the going was good thanks mainly to the wonderful job the PAP performed of enhancing the asset value of the majority of Singaporeans.

They arrived in their adopted countries with a couple of million in the bank and have never had to do a stroke of real work since.

5th category - those that stood against PAP and eventually forced to leave. examples are francis seow, tan wah piao etc.

 

[scroobal]

Hear , Hear. Nothing like seeing the rainbow at the end.

Whatever it is - whether one finds the rainbow or went back, they all can say that they gave it a go.

I remember the first time, I heard about migration in a big way was when the Malaysian Govt announced that Malay will be the main language and many people began to make the move. This was in the 70s. In the main 1st world destination countries, it was the Malaysians that first began organising pot luck sessions in their new country for people to meet and mingle.

The Singaporeans began the move in the early 80s and by 1985 a steady stream emerged. Interestingly it was Canada, OZ and NZ that was in the picture from the very start. These were primarily school teachers.

Then the Singapore civil service retirees. Now it is the kids that first went across for their tertiary education that began to think ahead.

I have been a member from old Delphi forum since 1999 and still remember this quote vividly. I emigrated in 2001 and I was lucky to get a job offer before I landed. Since then everything is smooth sailing..What I cherish the most is the freedom and time to drive across this vast amount of land and enjoy some of the most stunning scenery mother nature can offer. If I have stayed in Spore, I believe I will definitely be driving a taxi criss-crossing Spore.

 

[nayr69sg]

Yeah the support from one's spouse is very important. Both must have the same desire to migrate and also have the same intention to pay the price.

Not a simple feat.

For singles the challenge is different because it can be lonely coming to a new country all on your own.

I've met quite a few Malaysians here in Edmonton. Very nice people. Come to think of it, I know more Malaysians than Singaporeans here on a personal basis now.

I have always wondered something though. Are all Singaporeans who migrate the ones who are always polite and nice in Singapore? What about those who behave badly? None of them migrate?

 

[neddy]

I know a few odd cases of extended family pressure driving the family to migrate.

Unbearable mother-in-laws

MIL asking the daughter & son-in-law to run errands but her doctor sons too precious to do those dirty jobs.

MIL controlling the son and wanting to live with family. First thing is ask the son to lay marble flooring for HDB flat, later to dump and rearrange the kitchen pantry.

The worst I have seen, a Taiwanese MIL wanting to keep her daughter's income and spend only the son-in-law money.

In the first 2 cases, the couple met while studying in Australia. So, the decision is less difficult.

 

[Ash007]

I know a few odd cases of extended family pressure driving the family to migrate.

Unbearable mother-in-laws

MIL asking the daughter & son-in-law to run errands but her doctor sons too precious to do those dirty jobs.

MIL controlling the son and wanting to live with family. First thing is ask the son to lay marble flooring for HDB flat, later to dump and rearrange the kitchen pantry.

The worst I have seen, a Taiwanese MIL wanting to keep her daughter's income and spend only the son-in-law money.

In the first 2 cases, the couple met while studying in Australia. So, the decision is less difficult.

In cases like these its better to move to another country so that you don't have to be put under pressure.

 

[neddy]

In cases like these its better to move to another country so that you don't have to be put under pressure.

Tell you this real story.

The MIL even learn driving in Singapore then fly all the way to Perth, only to discover the son is not there. Fake address. I help collect mails for this person.

A few days before departure, the MIL shout loudly that the bad woman (daughter-in-law) want to break up the family and not allow her to see her grandkids anymore. You scared or not!

Moreover, she flies all the way from Singapore and wants to stay for months to look after the kids. Die lah! Not sure what happened.

Hopefully, he is OK. I have not hear from him for sometime now. But the last trick was to use father kena stroke to pull him back.

In case this story sound familiar to you. Yes, this MIL held a high post in the financial sector in the past. Apologies if I reveal too much.

 

[Ash007]

Tell you this real story.

The MIL even learn driving in Singapore then fly all the way to Perth, only to discover the son is not there. Fake address. I help collect mails for this person.

A few days before departure, the MIL shout loudly that the bad woman (daughter-in-law) want to break up the family and not allow her to see her grandkids anymore. You scared or not!

Moreover, she flies all the way from Singapore and wants to stay for months to look after the kids. Die lah! Not sure what happened.

Hopefully, he is OK. I have not hear from him for sometime now. But the last trick was to use father kena stroke to pull him back.

In case this story sound familiar to you. Yes, this MIL held a high post in the financial sector in the past. Apologies if I reveal too much.

You know the strange thing about this MIL. It sounds exactly like my mother! Every girl I bring back she complain not good this not good that. After break up, say aiyah why don't you go back to that previous one. That one very good blah blah. I have a feeling this would happen if I had stayed in Singapore. Hence part of the reason to move here. I never expect to find this story to be so similar to what I've gone through. This scenario is what I want to avoid when I get married.

 

[neddy]

You know the strange thing about this MIL. It sounds exactly like my mother! Every girl I bring back she complain not good this not good that. After break up, say aiyah why don't you go back to that previous one. That one very good blah blah. I have a feeling this would happen if I had stayed in Singapore. Hence part of the reason to move here. I never expect to find this story to be so similar to what I've gone through. This scenario is what I want to avoid when I get married.

Actually, the MIL got along well with the daughter-in-law, but I think something happened at work, not convenient to describe in details here since I do not know the full story. But those types of events relate to people who overstayed in high positions and when they lost their position and the status that go along , their character changed. Or could it be simply menopause.

But whatever it is, sometimes, it is better to stay further. 相见好同住难