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Serious End of Project Starlight

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
I don't think it had anything to do with pressure from China or acceding to their request. We have been expanding in Australia for over 20 years and the recent major investment might make it more economical to use and it can be used all year round.

I also don't think the Taiwanese want us out either as they need continuous political interactions with countries especially another Chinese majority nation to show their independence from China.

Anyway the comments are coming from China and not from anywhere else.

My sense is that Starlight will remain as it is not just military training but a political statement that we cannot be pushed round. We had previous issues over Starlight. In the early 90s, the whole civil service was advised not to talk about Taiwan.
 

Sideswipe

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
I still don't understand the rationale behind sending our NSmen overseas for training?

I think we are the only country doing it.

Armed Forces of a country is very sovereign matter. Armed foreigners in battalion formation in your country is usually called occupation or an invasion.

Especially for us....our main concept is defense and why train our troops in a foreign environment that has no benefits to us in the event of really defending our own terrain?


according to the SAF, it is a well-thought-out strategy to permanently station SG troops and military equipments in foreign countries. if someday, SG is conquered and occupied by another country, it's not the end. SG still have troops and military bases in friendly countries. those bases will be the launching pads for SG soldiers, fully armed and equipped to counterattack and recover motherland SG. you better believe it...hahaha...
 

Sideswipe

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
very interesting that SG held military exercises with both China and Taiwan in recent years. SG is spying for whom ?
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
Need space for training and storing of equipment. Middle of the US, far right of OZ and down in remote NZ and SA also keeps prying eyes away.

We only built our underground complex and hangars in the 90s.

Other countries do the same for various reasons such terrain and climate training which they may not have back home. The Royal Marines having in Pulada, South Johor every year and their ships docks on the Johor side across Sembawang.

We send our men for OCS to Sandhurst, Duntroon, India, Philippines, etc and vice versa. The Malaysians have sent their staff to our Command courses and vice versa.

Difficult to live in a vacuum.

Btw, Perth will be our location for cabinet in exile in the event of an invasion. They all have homes there since the 90s.

I still don't understand the rationale behind sending our NSmen overseas for training?

I think we are the only country doing it.

Armed Forces of a country is very sovereign matter. Armed foreigners in battalion formation in your country is usually called occupation or an invasion.

Especially for us....our main concept is defense and why train our troops in a foreign environment that has no benefits to us in the event of really defending our own terrain?
 

The_Hypocrite

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
I still don't understand the rationale behind sending our NSmen overseas for training?

I think we are the only country doing it.

Armed Forces of a country is very sovereign matter. Armed foreigners in battalion formation in your country is usually called occupation or an invasion.

Especially for us....our main concept is defense and why train our troops in a foreign environment that has no benefits to us in the event of really defending our own terrain?

Shortage of land to train.... cannot do those tank maneuvers like Patton...so to get the thrill they r sent overseas..also in terms of war the Singkieland doctrine is to invade Johor to prevent the enemy from reaching our shores...but weather it can be done by a conscript army I don't know...but also now SAF is all about providing jobs for the scholar generals abs the ST military industrial complex
 

bobby

Alfrescian
Loyal
Need space for training and storing of equipment. Middle of the US, far right of OZ and down in remote NZ and SA also keeps prying eyes away.

We only built our underground complex and hangars in the 90s.

Other countries do the same for various reasons such terrain and climate training which they may not have back home. The Royal Marines having in Pulada, South Johor every year and their ships docks on the Johor side across Sembawang.

We send our men for OCS to Sandhurst, Duntroon, India, Philippines, etc and vice versa. The Malaysians have sent their staff to our Command courses and vice versa.

Difficult to live in a vacuum.

Btw, Perth will be our location for cabinet in exile in the event of an invasion. They all have homes there since the 90s.

I agree that some countries do exchange military best practices...especially among professional soldiers and commanders.

Our bunch is all conscripts with absolutely no experience whatsoever and on cases a reluctant soldier.

How the host country can benefit from these exercises bewilders me...unless there is a significant economic persuasion.
 

sleaguepunter

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset

globaltimes credibility is as high as shit times. It just a pressure by CCP to pinkie that CCP want Ex Starlight to end.

Ex Starlight not as simple as send troops to Hukow just to train. It also give saf staff officers to experience brigade size exercise with ROC troops. I never been to Hukow even though i from armour(sad) but i understand from a pink ic new citizen(ROC) that he(tankee) ever trained with saf armour troops in Hukow. It very rare for saf to conduct even battalion level exercise in singapore, let alone brigade. SAF also get to use the ROC misslie firing range to conduct live firing of missiles which is impossible in singapore.

Ex Starlight also allow exchange weapon technology. It was said on ROC tv program that ROC send 12 F5EII to singapore to convert to 11 RF5E with 1F5E as payment. It was alleged that saf was use as a front by ROC to buy weapons on the sly. i only quoting from what i heard from retire ROC general on tv.
 

sleaguepunter

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Shortage of land to train.... cannot do those tank maneuvers like Patton...so to get the thrill they r sent overseas..also in terms of war the Singkieland doctrine is to invade Johor to prevent the enemy from reaching our shores...but weather it can be done by a conscript army I don't know...but also now SAF is all about providing jobs for the scholar generals abs the ST military industrial complex

The Mersing Line Doctrine long ago become obsolete by the purchase of brazilian AstroII MLRS by msia many years ago.
 

Rogue Trader

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
I still don't understand the rationale behind sending our NSmen overseas for training?

I think we are the only country doing it.

Armed Forces of a country is very sovereign matter. Armed foreigners in battalion formation in your country is usually called occupation or an invasion.

Especially for us....our main concept is defense and why train our troops in a foreign environment that has no benefits to us in the event of really defending our own terrain?

foreigner spotted
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
The Taiwanese have been wanting to cut the agreement for the longest time.
No one wants foreign troops on their land. The Taiwanese agreed to it way back then due to economic reasons.
The terms were actually very generous. On top of the yearly millions in 'rental'....They get to keep the base and everything.
If you've been there at the beginning you'll see how much the areas around the bases have developed. The Taiwanese businesses used to love us to death.
Guess now they are economically well off and can afford to tell us to fuck off.

Not really economic reasons. The original arrangement was made between Chiang Ching Kuo and Old Fart. Both of them were good buddies. And Old fart brought up the land constraint problem in zikapore. Chiang agreed to allow the training bases to be there. But we had to have separate facilities. Back then, our military and their military were quite close. they seconded their retired admiral to run and expand our RSN. But things changed for taiwan, the KMT and chiang family are no longer in charge. while saying that, things have not changed in singapore. hence, the current crop of taiwanese are largely indifferent to whether we are there or not.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
Yes anyone who been thru NS would know starlight, crescendo, lancer, wallaby.
Later they got mayasia and India. I dunno what they called those

The indian one is called Exercise Agni Warrior, I am not aware we exercise our army units with malaysia anymore.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
Ex Starlight,after deployment go for supper and hairwash and fried bee hoon and hot tea sold by the village mei meis. Only can remember the past with sweet memories.

I don't what kind of memories u have. After exercise, R & R in Taipeh. where got village mei meis?
 

Narong Wongwan

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Not really economic reasons. The original arrangement was made between Chiang Ching Kuo and Old Fart. Both of them were good buddies. And Old fart brought up the land constraint problem in zikapore. Chiang agreed to allow the training bases to be there. But we had to have separate facilities. Back then, our military and their military were quite close. they seconded their retired admiral to run and expand our RSN. But things changed for taiwan, the KMT and chiang family are no longer in charge. while saying that, things have not changed in singapore. hence, the current crop of taiwanese are largely indifferent to whether we are there or not.

Taiwan was a better place back then under martial law. Maybe they see us NS slaves as soldiers also so accorded us due respect. Later on law and order wasn't so good after martial law lifted but we still got respects as the old Hokkien pengs all could fight well. But not the case anymore now
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
globaltimes credibility is as high as shit times. It just a pressure by CCP to pinkie that CCP want Ex Starlight to end.

Ex Starlight not as simple as send troops to Hukow just to train. It also give saf staff officers to experience brigade size exercise with ROC troops. I never been to Hukow even though i from armour(sad) but i understand from a pink ic new citizen(ROC) that he(tankee) ever trained with saf armour troops in Hukow. It very rare for saf to conduct even battalion level exercise in singapore, let alone brigade. SAF also get to use the ROC misslie firing range to conduct live firing of missiles which is impossible in singapore.

Ex Starlight also allow exchange weapon technology. It was said on ROC tv program that ROC send 12 F5EII to singapore to convert to 11 RF5E with 1F5E as payment. It was alleged that saf was use as a front by ROC to buy weapons on the sly. i only quoting from what i heard from retire ROC general on tv.
when we first started training in Taiwan, there was no missile range to speak off, and we never had missiles until we got the Milan. Our main Anti tank weapon was the 84mm Carl Gustav recoiless and the LAW. I am not even sure there is a missile range now, maybe in Kaohshiung. The main 2 reasons that armour was there was there was to train at company level strenght in the wide spaces on Hukou plateau and for their tank firing range. There was no butt at that time in the whole of SE Asia that could safely take a 105mm HE or even APFSDS. That was why our KP were stationed there. To my knowledge, no ROC armour units ever trained with SAF armour units. I am not sure about infantry, but I heard it was the same too. We never exchanged technology with them for the armour units. When Chartered was developing a APFSDS round for the AMX-13, we did offer to develop it with the Taiwanese as they also needed a smaller calibre APFSDS round for their M41 tanks. But they declined to participate. also to my knowledge, we never trained in brigade level exercise with the ROC army either. U must be getting your info some where else. Or my infor is outdated.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
Taiwan was a better place back then under martial law. Maybe they see us NS slaves as soldiers also so accorded us due respect. Later on law and order wasn't so good after martial law lifted but we still got respects as the old Hokkien pengs all could fight well. But not the case anymore now
Yep, now 80% of the soldiers we send to train in ROC are speckies. They make for a good laugh for the taiwanese.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
The Mersing Line Doctrine long ago become obsolete by the purchase of brazilian AstroII MLRS by msia many years ago.

The Astro II has no bearing on the Mersing Line doctrine. that doctrine was more a red herring then any thing. There were contingency plans to go all the way to KL and not stop at Mersing. But that would panic the m&ds, so hence we "stopped" at Mersing and held the line there.
 

Reddog

Alfrescian
Loyal
I only know Exercise Starlight. Only foreigners and non NSmen will call it a Project Starlight. If you have gone there, its always burnt into you as Exercise Starlight. Project Starlight is simi lancheow minkia, I dunno?

Officially (that is, at the command level) it is called Project Starlight.
 
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