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Thread: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

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    Default The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists



    Last month, Minister in the Prime Minister's Department Shahidan Kassim launched a moral panic against atheists in Malaysia, calling on members of the public to assist the authorities in clamping down on this supposedly dangerous group of people.

    For the minister to use the words "hunt down" in reference to atheists bodes ill for any efforts towards the acceptance of minorities within Malaysia, in this case individuals who do not believe in a religion. It certainly demonstrates a no-nonsense approach towards people deemed to be threatening Islam as a religion and a system of values in the Muslim-majority country.

    Beyond this rhetoric however, there are intellectual issues to tackle vis-à-vis the monopolisation of one belief system at the expense of the safety of those who do not subscribe to this system.

    What sparked this moral panic was a photo posted by the Kuala Lumpur chapter of the non-profit Atheist Republic, an organisation which “provides opportunities for non-believers around the world to gather with like-minded people”. The photo showed about 20 men and women coming together to celebrate diversity within the atheist community.

    Minister Shahidan immediately asked for an investigation to determine if any Muslims were part of this burgeoning atheist community, or rather ex-Muslims who have joined them.

    Additionally, he said that Muslims who became atheists ought to be re-educated, with the help of Muslim religious scholars, so that they can "return to the right path".

    That apostasy is not a federal crime in Malaysia does not seem to matter as the country inexorably veers towards an attitude that marginalises (ir)religious minorities, hence compromising one's freedom to practice or not practice a religion.

    In the case of atheists, there is an attitude of condescension embedded in this marginalisation, in which they are deemed to be confused about and ignorant of Islam. This marginalisation is also legally enshrined as Muslims are not allowed to officially renounce Islam.

    Instead, Muslims doubting their faith are encouraged to go for rehabilitation or counselling. This means that from a legal and sociological point of view, it is safe to say that atheists are deemed as deviant, enjoying the same label as Shia Muslims in Malaysia.

    Moving forward

    There has to be a way in moving forward regarding the perception of atheists at the state level and the grassroots level...

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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    No compulsion in Islam, phui! Phew!


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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Its just a warning but never imposed. Like a discouragement.

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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by duluxe View Post
    No compulsion in Islam, phui! Phew!

    Waiting for our "no compulsion" resident to come condemn this behaviour.
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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnTan View Post
    Waiting for our "no compulsion" resident to come condemn this behaviour.
    Yup! Tats wat is stated in d Quran teres no compulsion in religion. So many verses in d Quran suggested so. Watever laws/policies implemented by d govt is for d good of Muslims in Msia. If they wish to murtad they shld be counsel. No parents wld love to see their chdn denounce their religion. U love to watch ur love ones embrace Islam? "Apostate" is not a worldly crime.
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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by whoami View Post
    Yup! Tats wat is stated in d Quran teres no compulsion in religion. So many verses in d Quran suggested so. Watever laws/policies implemented by d govt is for d good of Muslims in Msia. If they wish to murtad they shld be counsel.
    And there we go. Shouting 'no compulsion in islam' on one hand, but locking apostates up and forcing them to recant before letting them go. Unless you have another definition to 'counsel'.

    Your mudland clerics clearly disagree with your 'no compulsion in islam' bullshit by pressuring the government to enact laws to harm apostates. And you call those policies good even though you say they have no quranic basis?? You are contradicting yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by whoami
    No parents wld love to see their chdn denounce their religion. U love to watch ur love ones embrace Islam? "Apostate" is not a worldly crime.
    Disgusting and nauseating to see my loved ones embrace islam. But there is no compulsion in my religion. I won't be locking them up and forcing them to recant. I just have to let them go in peace. Period.

    That is what I mean by no compulsion in religion, not your dishonest way of locking up people and pressuring them to recant way of 'no compulsion'.

    Can't imagine myself sinking so low as to embrace your type of religious values.
    Last edited by JohnTan; 10-09-2017 at 10:36 AM.
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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnTan View Post
    And there we go. Shouting 'no compulsion in islam' on one hand, locking apostates up and forcing them to recant before letting them go. Unless you have another definition to 'counsel'.

    Your mudland clerics clearly disagree with your 'no compulsion in islam' bullshit by pressuring the government to enact laws to harm apostates. And you call those policies good even though you say they have no quranic basis?? You are contradicting yourself.



    Disgusting and nauseating to see my loved ones embrace islam. But there is no compulsion in my religion. I won't be locking them up and forcing them to recant. I just have to let them go in peace. Period.

    That is what I mean by no compulsion in religion, not your dishonest way of locking up people and pressuring them to recant way of 'no compulsion'.

    Can't imagine myself sinking so low as to embrace your type of religious values.
    If it happen to my fam i will advise them to consider thoroughly. I had mentioned sm time ago my relative chdn who did not practise Islam n their chdn married to non Muslims. Their parent did not throw throw them out. We still went to their hm during hari raya. No probm. But indeed it wld be very unfortunate if sm Muslims deviate fm d truth i.e. Islam n renouces Islam.

    No lah. We dont stoop so low as to market our religion knockg on doors, visitg hosps etc. Tats wat we meant by no compulsion in religion.
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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    This minister deserved to be shot,,,,Singapore is supposed to have religious freedom,,,,sure some religions can be banned like 7 day advantists,,,but other than that its not really an issue,,the minister should recite the pledge

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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by whoami View Post
    If it happen to my fam i will advise them to consider thoroughly. I had mentioned sm time ago my relative chdn who did not practise Islam n their chdn married to non Muslims. Their parent did not throw throw them out. We still went to their hm during hari raya. No probm. But indeed it wld be very unfortunate if sm Muslims deviate fm d truth i.e. Islam n renouces Islam.
    Sorry for the parents unhappiness. Happy for the children's happiness. Because they live in Singapore, "no compulsion" people like you leave them alone. In muslim majority malaysia, "no compulsion" people like you are okay with government policies to jail them until they are pressured to recant. With your kind of warped mentality, why do you think many of us are wary of your ilk?

    Glad to also clarify from you finally that islam's 'no compulsion' in religion doesn't rule out coercing apostates to recant, especially in muslim-majority societies like mudland, whose tactics you approve and doesn't count as 'no compulsion'. That basically settles our long 'no compulsion' discussion.

    Quote Originally Posted by whoami
    No lah. We dont stoop so low as to market our religion knockg on doors, visitg hosps etc. Tats wat we meant by no compulsion in religion.
    What's wrong with knocking on doors and visiting patients in the hospital?

    Drop that act. Islamic preachers and mullahs market islam very much more shamelessly and aggressively. In Sarawak, there are news of islamic teachers converting christian students within schools, including in christian mission schools, into islam. Any condemnation from you regarding your islamic teachers and clerics targetting christian kids for conversion to islam by brainwashing in school, coercion and bribery?

    Adenan, responding to outrage expressed by Dayak parents of the students as well as Dayak-based groups, had pledged to intervene, but stressed that he would first find out more details about the appointment and Roslin’s background.

    Parents and Dayak groups have expressed fears that Roslin, being a religious teacher and from Kelantan, would influence the Christian students to convert to Islam as in many cases reported in Sarawak over the past years.



    https://sg.news.yahoo.com/muslim-rel...083200931.html


    KOTA KINABALU, March 27 — Not two months after an alleged Islamic conversion of a 16-year-old in Sabah hit the news, a 13-year-old Iban schoolgirl from Miri, Sarawak, is now claiming that that two teachers from her school attempted to convert her to Islam.

    In a police report, the form one student at SMK Lutong said that she was lured to a house in the Samling residential area in Kuala Baram with two unidentified women and three men.

    They picked her up from her home in Kuala Baram and took her to the house a few kilometres away where they allegedly made her recite a Muslim prayer.

    They then gave me RM200 in cash and later another RM50 and prayer scarves. I told them I had no intention of being Muslim as my whole family are Christians,” she said in her police report dated March 25.


    Read more at http://www.themalaymailonline.com/ma...OG94Qxa6ZwR.99
    Last edited by JohnTan; 10-09-2017 at 12:42 PM.
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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnTan View Post
    Sorry for the parents unhappiness. Happy for the children's happiness. Because they live in Singapore, "no compulsion" people like you leave them alone. In muslim majority malaysia, "no compulsion" people like you are okay with government policies to jail them until they are pressured to recant. With your kind of warped mentality, why do you think many of us are wary of your ilk?

    Glad to also clarify from you finally that islam's 'no compulsion' in religion doesn't rule out coercing apostates to recant, especially in muslim-majority societies like mudland, whose tactics you approve and doesn't count as 'no compulsion'. That basically settles our long 'no compulsion' discussion.



    Drop that act. Islamic preachers and mullahs market islam very much more shamelessly and aggressively. In Sarawak, there are news of islamic teachers converting christian students within schools, including in christian mission schools, into islam. Any condemnation from you regarding "marketing of religion" by muslims?


    I repeat again. No parent be happy to see their love ones convert other religion. Tat include me. As for wat practise in msia such tat murtad being advise to reconsider their action, i tink is harmless. Afterall is their love ones.

    As for those case u quoted in sarawak..were tere thousand cases reported? I cant help it if sm ppl r overzealous...doesnt practise wat they preach. Nothg to do with d Quran.
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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by whoami View Post
    I repeat again. No parent be happy to see their love ones convert other religion. Tat include me. As for wat practise in msia such tat murtad being advise to reconsider their action, i tink is harmless. Afterall is their love ones.

    As for those case u quoted in sarawak..were tere thousand cases reported? I cant help it if sm ppl r overzealous...doesnt practise wat they preach. Nothg to do with d Quran.
    As I expected, no condemnation of those who compel others to stay in islam and unscrupulous targetting of kids for islamic conversion. Instead, there's approval and plain deflection on your part.
    I hope people who share your extremist beliefs get put away eventually. I think it's harmless too.
    Last edited by JohnTan; 10-09-2017 at 12:52 PM.
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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnTan View Post
    As I expected, no condemnation of those who compel others to stay in islam and unscrupulous targetting of kids for islamic conversion. Instead, there's approval and plain deflection on your part.
    I hope people who share your extremist beliefs get put away eventually. I think it's harmless too.
    U seow ya? Y cant i give advise to my love ones? As parent i dont wish to see them go astray. U called tat extremist? Hey! Go take ur medication john
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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnTan View Post
    As I expected, no condemnation of those who compel others to stay in islam and unscrupulous targetting of kids for islamic conversion. Instead, there's approval and plain deflection on your part.
    I hope people who share your extremist beliefs get put away eventually. I think it's harmless too.
    I tell you the no-compulsion idiot is over brainwashed by arabian myths, even camel urine tests sweet. Mainstream malay muslims believe apostates must be killed! Sinkieland Islam is tengah suku. Only in sinkieland, muslims are directed by their religion (political) leaders to dispense porridge to (aide) non-muslims. Where else in muslim majority country you find that?




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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by duluxe View Post
    I tell you the no-compulsion idiot is over brainwashed by arabian myths, even camel urine tests sweet. Mainstream malay muslims believe apostates must be killed! Sinkieland Islam is tengah suku. Only in sinkieland, muslims are directed by their religion (political) leaders to dispense porridge to (aide) non-muslims. Where else in muslim majority country you find that?



    Aiyoh. Ev day keep harpg on apostate lah mutad lah when teres no such law in d Quran. Muslims r not perfect. No one is perfect except God. Ev country have their own laws. Who r u to question them? N y so kiasu ..need to post 2 times? Haha..

    As for sharg of porridges with non muslims, giving donations to non muslim/countries... goes to show Islam teaches compassion. Such idea/gesture has got nothg to do with politics. Some of those expenses were fm muslims mthly contributn to Muis n donations to Mosque.

    Duluxe. Ur a trouble maker. U like to fan hatred n instil suspicion among muslims n non muslims. Wat is ur agenda? U wish to see another riot in Spore?
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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by whoami View Post

    No lah. We dont stoop so low as to market our religion knockg on doors, visitg hosps etc. Tats wat we meant by no compulsion in religion.
    Are you practising taqiyya? There's no such thing as dawah? What you practise in Singapore is not a definition of your religion. What's in your holy scriptures define your religion.

    Besides, if you believe you have the truth and non-believer is going to hell for all eternity, why do you not to go warn people about it?

    Christians knocking on doors do it out of love and concern, they do not force people to listen to them do it, this is real "no compulsion".

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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by whoami View Post
    when teres no such law in d Quran.
    How about the hadiths?

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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    The fact is, even the quran was not written by prophet mohamad. Its was printed after his death from those who professed to memorised his sayings. So who knows what is right and wrong. Hadith even worse. Its was written down one generation aftrr prophets death.
    Now there must be a reason why prophet mohamed refused to write it all down himself.
    Nothing. Zero. No historian wrote about prophet mohamed during the time when he was alive.whatever you read about him were written about 50-100 years after his death.so some historians are saying he could be made up.a fictional figure.the quran essentially are stories based on jewish old testament, so it could be easy to create one.
    Or whatever his teaching were, were totally erased by the arabs as it threatened their hiearchy.
    Much like what happened to confucious.
    Last edited by syed putra; 11-09-2017 at 07:08 AM.

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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    I haven't met a 100% sane muslim yet.

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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by whoami View Post
    Aiyoh. Ev day keep harpg on apostate lah mutad lah when teres no such law in d Quran. Muslims r not perfect. No one is perfect except God. Ev country have their own laws. Who r u to question them? N y so kiasu ..need to post 2 times? Haha..

    As for sharg of porridges with non muslims, giving donations to non muslim/countries... goes to show Islam teaches compassion. Such idea/gesture has got nothg to do with politics. Some of those expenses were fm muslims mthly contributn to Muis n donations to Mosque.

    Duluxe. Ur a trouble maker. U like to fan hatred n instil suspicion among muslims n non muslims. Wat is ur agenda? U wish to see another riot in Spore?
    Alamak, it's a different image. Go read the contents. All the the problems are caused by Muslims, you idiot one always put the blame on non-muslims. Never see you point the finger at that Muslim NUS lecturer for the suspicion he created.

    Can you give one Muslim country that helps non-muslims like giving free scholarship? I already told sg Islam is heavily scripted and controlled by politics.

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    Default Re: The "hunt down" plight of Malay atheists

    Quote Originally Posted by whoami View Post
    U seow ya? Y cant i give advise to my love ones? As parent i dont wish to see them go astray. U called tat extremist? Hey! Go take ur medication john
    Why do you equate 'leaving Islam' as going astray when on the other hand you repeatedly claim there is no compulsion in Islam?

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