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Chitchat Bond investors in Spore be careful

johnny333

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
After reading some of the stories shared here, I concluded it is better to have no investment rather than anyhow invest. At least your money is still safe in the bank and will grow somehow.


If you decide to keep it in the bank you will only get the interest rate which is very low.


I own ordinary Malaysian & US shares which give me enough dividends that I can life comfortably live on.
Keep in mind that it take time & money to build up your portfolio before you can enjoy the fruits.

If you are a newbie you should look at investing in Index funds, probably an index ETF.
They can provide a return of 5% to 11% per year depending on how many years you hold a fund.

Other than the dividend, the funds value may also appreciate.
If you don't know what an index fund is take a look at the following video:
[video=youtube;buR6Wvq8s38]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buR6Wvq8s38[/video]
 

ginfreely

Alfrescian
Loyal
You never forget but you move on & try best to go on:smile:

That was my biggest lost & I haven't recovered yet. That is why today I am more conservative & looking into safer investments like buying indexes. Maybe in 10 years time I can recover some of those for loses. I have regrets about the loses I made, could have bought a condo, gotten more dividend shares,...:o

Fortunately I can get by with the dividends I am making today.

Those who have lost $$$ learn that there are no short cuts in making money. It seems that everyone I know have made some big mistakes at least once in their lifetime: from gambling, from playing the stock market, some loss making investment ... The lucky ones recover & move on but some never learn & go on to losing everything. Or even committing suicide.

Well that's my little story & I think it was $800k+ I haven't tallied the real cost because it's so painful.

Thanks for sharing. Good to hear such real stories and not all the mudlander coward liars talking shit.
 

johnny333

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Thanks for sharing. Good to hear such real stories and not all the mudlander coward liars talking shit.

I got some shares of Public Bank which has been given me dividends for sometime. Haven't done anything with it so far. I''m thinking of using all that ringgit to get some Maybank shares because they recently gave a dividend of almost 6.9%.
 

ginfreely

Alfrescian
Loyal
I got some shares of Public Bank which has been given me dividends for sometime. Haven't done anything with it so far. I''m thinking of using all that ringgit to get some Maybank shares because they recently gave a dividend of almost 6.9%.

Oh maybank shares, I have it and it gives out scrip dividends and so I have more shares added every now and then. Not bad but price seems to have dropped to below Rm8.
 

johnny333

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Oh maybank shares, I have it and it gives out scrip dividends and so I have more shares added every now and then. Not bad but price seems to have dropped to below Rm8.

I notice that price is down & that's one of the reasons other than the dividend that I am looking at it. Public Bank had a rights issue that gives you a choice of buying more. Is that the same with Maybank. Did you have to pay for the extra shares or was it a split?
 

ginfreely

Alfrescian
Loyal
I notice that price is down & that's one of the reasons other than the dividend that I am looking at it. Public Bank had a rights issue that gives you a choice of buying more. Is that the same with Maybank. Did you have to pay for the extra shares or was it a split?

No I didn't pay for extra shares. The broker will ask you whether want to receive the maybank dividends in cash or shares and if you choose shares, they will convert the dividend amount to shares with a little balance - that cannot be converted to shares - given in cash.
 

johnny333

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
No I didn't pay for extra shares. The broker will ask you whether want to receive the maybank dividends in cash or shares and if you choose shares, they will convert the dividend amount to shares with a little balance - that cannot be converted to shares - given in cash.

One of the reasons I like investing in Malaysia is that they have all these schemes like right issues, option to re-invest, etc to encourage you to re-invest. Since I'm a long term investor it suites me better. In Spore the companies I invested in are usually acquired by other companies & minority stake holders like me are forced to sell even if it is at a loss.

I know people who initially bought a small number of Malaysian share but over the years their holdings grew & grew & now they are receiving sizeable dividends.
I expect this to continue because companies in Malaysia need more cash to expand their businesses, so they will try to temp investors to invest more :smile:

I originally opened a Malaysian trading account to store the shares I bought through CLOB in Spore but now I am hooked on buying more Malaysian shares. I think in the future the ringgit is going to appreciate & when that happens my Malaysian dividends are going to be worth more. Currently I will use the dividends to re-invest in Malaysia. Just as I am using my US$ dividends to re-invest in the US.

Investing can be fun:smile:
 

ginfreely

Alfrescian
Loyal
One of the reasons I like investing in Malaysia is that they have all these schemes like right issues, option to re-invest, etc to encourage you to re-invest. Since I'm a long term investor it suites me better. In Spore the companies I invested in are usually acquired by other companies & minority stake holders like me are forced to sell even if it is at a loss.

I know people who initially bought a small number of Malaysian share but over the years their holdings grew & grew & now they are receiving sizeable dividends.
I expect this to continue because companies in Malaysia need more cash to expand their businesses, so they will try to temp investors to invest more :smile:

I originally opened a Malaysian trading account to store the shares I bought through CLOB in Spore but now I am hooked on buying more Malaysian shares. I think in the future the ringgit is going to appreciate & when that happens my Malaysian dividends are going to be worth more. Currently I will use the dividends to re-invest in Malaysia. Just as I am using my US$ dividends to re-invest in the US.

Investing can be fun:smile:

I think better don't invest too much in Malaysia as the ringgit keeps falling. But since invested already I just keep the maybank shares that give out dividends. I didn't really monitor Malaysia stock market but their prices seem quite stable indeed, maybank shares price moved around rm8 to 10 plus I recall.
 

johnny333

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
I think better don't invest too much in Malaysia as the ringgit keeps falling. But since invested already I just keep the maybank shares that give out dividends. I didn't really monitor Malaysia stock market but their prices seem quite stable indeed, maybank shares price moved around rm8 to 10 plus I think.

I am currently living on the dividends I am getting from my Malaysian shares. Even with the weak ringgit it is a 5 figure SGD$ amount
it's not much but it's enough for my simple lifestyle. My home is fully paid for & I don't have a car.

I don't have to touch my US$ dividends. I will be using that to invest in the US.
 

eatshitndie

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
I am currently living on the dividends I am getting from my Malaysian shares. Even with the weak ringgit it is a 5 figure SGD$ amount
it's not much but it's enough for my simple lifestyle. My home is fully paid for & I don't have a car.

I don't have to touch my US$ dividends. I will be using that to invest in the US.

political instability and leadership turmoil. ml regime, current or future, can suka suka impose capital and currency controls and your investments can get stuck in limboland.
 

Ash007

Alfrescian
Loyal
paper rich, cash poor. Oil looks like it might be near its bottom maybe time to load up on some oil stocks. Noticed they bonds is on oil services, not on an actual oil company.
 

Ash007

Alfrescian
Loyal
If you decide to keep it in the bank you will only get the interest rate which is very low.


I own ordinary Malaysian & US shares which give me enough dividends that I can life comfortably live on.
Keep in mind that it take time & money to build up your portfolio before you can enjoy the fruits.

If you are a newbie you should look at investing in Index funds, probably an index ETF.
They can provide a return of 5% to 11% per year depending on how many years you hold a fund.

Other than the dividend, the funds value may also appreciate.
If you don't know what an index fund is take a look at the following video:
[video=youtube;buR6Wvq8s38]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buR6Wvq8s38[/video]


Its not just for newbies. Warren Buffet is a big fan of it as well. So much that he decided to leave it as an ETF as an inheritance after he pass away. That is saying a lot about ETFs from the oracle of Omahague.

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/warren-buffett-to-heirs-put-my-estate-in-index-funds-2014-03-13

Warren Buffett to heirs: Put my estate in index funds

Published: Mar 13, 2014 5:00 a.m. ET

126
Bloomberg
Farmer Buffett says invest in stocks like you would a farm — and watch your garden grow.
If you follow the career of billionaire investor Warren Buffett, you likely have kept up on the succession chatter of late.

After all, Buffet is 83 now. Sooner or later, someone will take the reins at his firm, Berkshire Hathaway, and that person will pick up the mantle of his amazing performance over the years.

They will be tough shoes to fill. Buffett racked up nearly a 20% annualized return through 2012 from 1965, turning a foundering textile mill into a holding company for ventures that span the globe and run the gamut from consumer goods and newspapers to industrial giants and railroads.

That compares to a 9.4% return on the Standard & Poor’s 500 Index SPX, +0.03% — quite a run. And while investors have long made the pilgrimage to Berkshire headquarters in Omaha to hear Buffett and his managers speak, they probably weren't prepared for his latest remarks on investing. He flatly endorsed a simple portfolio of inexpensive index funds for his own survivors.

Put your money in index funds and move on, he told them. Seriously, you'll do better. In fact, he said, that's what I plan to do with my own money once I am gone.

Here's the quote, from page 20 of his most recent annual letter to Berkshire shareholders, dated Feb. 28. After all of his Berkshire shares are distributed to charity, take the cash, Buffett says, and just buy index funds:

My advice to the trustee couldn't be more simple: Put 10% of the cash in short-term government bonds and 90% in a very low-cost S&P 500 index fund. (I suggest Vanguard's.) I believe the trust's long-term results from this policy will be superior to those attained by most investors — whether pension funds, institutions or individuals — who employ high-fee managers.

What's fascinating about this letter isn't that he favors passive investments. That much we already knew. Nor that he believes in stocks, as a 90/10 split clearly implies.

Ignore the chatter

What's fascinating is that he doesn't want his executor to keep the money in Berkshire, where presumably his influence would continue on for at least a few years. Nor does he want his surviving family to bother with Wall Street and active money managers.

Again, from the letter:

Both individuals and institutions will constantly be urged to be active by those who profit from giving advice or effecting transactions. The resulting frictional costs can be huge and, for investors in aggregate, devoid of benefit. So ignore the chatter, keep your costs minimal, and invest in stocks as you would in a farm.

It's an interesting notion, considering that Buffett himself owns a 400-acre farm. He admits up front he knows nothing about farming, but as investments go it isn't among the most sophisticated he's ever had to analyze.

The farming comparison, however, is right in line with how long-term portfolio investing really works to ensure that your retirement happens. You have to presume from the start that planting seed means, in time, a crop will grow.

There might be bad weather. There could be a crop failure one year or the next. There are certain costs of doing business, mostly predictable and best kept low.

And, largely, there's nothing to do. Like crops in the field, a long-term, mostly stock investment cannot help but produce a reasonable return — assuming you don't overthink it and don't spend willy-nilly in a vain attempt to make it grow faster.

Some will argue that Buffett's advice is a case of "do as I say and not as I do," and that's a fair criticism. For instance, on Berkshire's behalf he holds a small number of stocks in a limited number of sectors. One academic analysis of his Berkshire investments found a median holding period of one year.

'Do as I say'

But listen carefully to what Buffett is saying in his letter. Frictional costs are huge and, for investors in aggregate, devoid of benefit. He really is saying "do as I say, not as I do" because you and I aren't Warren Buffett.

The researchers put it this way:

Warren Buffett's record by the start of our sample period strongly suggests he is a gifted trader. His success in subsequent years in generating abnormal returns doesn't in itself imply market inefficiency. Rather such returns can be construed as compensation for his extraordinary talent and acquisition of private information.

Do you have access to the same private information as Warren Buffett? Do you have his level of investing skill? Does your financial adviser?

If the answer to these questions is "no," just buy a portfolio of index funds and be a farmer about it. You'll do better than most, avoid losing money pointlessly to high-cost active managers and certainly do well enough over time to retire with more.

It's what Buffett is doing for his own family.
 

yangtzejiang

Alfrescian
Loyal
Don't buy shares until we monitor this October. We don't even know if Fed & BOJ will shock the market in the next 12-36hours.

As for Reits, Lippo's new 7% bonds today, will probably gives higher returns than their ordinary shares in the next 2-3 years.

Camping here for more insights from bro Run :smile:

anything on the horizon that might cause lippo to default?
 

johnny333

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
political instability and leadership turmoil. ml regime, current or future, can suka suka impose capital and currency controls and your investments can get stuck in limboland.

Welcome to the real world:biggrin:
Trump may win the US elections, political problems in Europe & UK, Spore is in recession,... Actually the best time to invest is when there is turmoil in the markets.

For years my Malaysian stock purchased through CLOB(a Spore market) was held in limbo until it was unfrozen by the Malaysian authorities. To be fair to Mahathir the reason he clamped down on the CLOB was because Malaysian shares were traded in Spore outside of the Malaysian market. The PAP ignored his warnings & that is why he did what he did.

The Malaysians even under Mahathir never prevented Sporeans from trading & getting their dividends from Malaysian shares, if they did it through Malaysian brokers.
I think his concern was that Malaysians should be making the $, if Malaysians shares were being traded.

I doubt the Malaysians would meddle with the market because they need the infusion of foreign money.
Anyway I've got money invested in the US market. If there is a hiccup in Malaysia I can tap into my investments there. I'm actually more concern about what is happening in Spore because I have a home there.
 

Ash007

Alfrescian
Loyal
Welcome to the real world:biggrin:
Trump may win the US elections, political problems in Europe & UK, Spore is in recession,... Actually the best time to invest is when there is turmoil in the markets.

For years my Malaysian stock purchased through CLOB(a Spore market) was held in limbo until it was unfrozen by the Malaysian authorities. To be fair to Mahathir the reason he clamped down on the CLOB was because Malaysian shares were traded in Spore outside of the Malaysian market. The PAP ignored his warnings & that is why he did what he did.

The Malaysians even under Mahathir never prevented Sporeans from trading & getting their dividends from Malaysian shares, if they did it through Malaysian brokers.
I think his concern was that Malaysians should be making the $, if Malaysians shares were being traded.

I doubt the Malaysians would meddle with the market because they need the infusion of foreign money.
Anyway I've got money invested in the US market. If there is a hiccup in Malaysia I can tap into my investments there. I'm actually more concern about what is happening in Spore because I have a home there.

The angmoh called it a contrarian view. The chinese called it opportunity. 危机,have crisis, then you have opportunity.
 

johnny333

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Its not just for newbies. Warren Buffet is a big fan of it as well. So much that he decided to leave it as an ETF as an inheritance after he pass away. That is saying a lot about ETFs from the oracle of Omahague.

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/warren-buffett-to-heirs-put-my-estate-in-index-funds-2014-03-13


I consider myself a newbie investor because I was too busy at work to learn & stay in touch with the market. A more accurate description is that I was & still am a passive investor. I was just lucky that I made more correct choices than loses. It was probably beginners luck.

It has become harder to make $ from the market ever since the sub prime crisis. The index funds have a good historical track record of making money & that is why in the future I will only invest in the index funds.
 

Runifyouhaveto

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Loyal
Welcome to the real world:biggrin:
Trump may win the US elections, political problems in Europe & UK, Spore is in recession,...

The best way to MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN is for Hillary to make a graceful withdrawal and someone like Sanders takes over.

Sanders will grab 70% of the popular votes against Trump and we will see US Dollar soaring like no tomorrow.
(use the right tool for the right opponent)
 

Ash007

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Loyal
I consider myself a newbie investor because I was too busy at work to learn & stay in touch with the market. A more accurate description is that I was & still am a passive investor. I was just lucky that I made more correct choices than loses. It was probably beginners luck.

It has become harder to make $ from the market ever since the sub prime crisis. The index funds have a good historical track record of making money & that is why in the future I will only invest in the index funds.

You are a passive investor just like Buffet. There is nothing wrong with that. I am the newbie here. I only started trading last year. :wink: Ahead 30% now by the way. Back to the topic of the other thread of why Singaporean and by extension this low protection for bond player. Its not that you can't play stock and expect a high return of 10%. But you have to weight your risk and value system and timeline! Some of these people went in expecting high returns in 1 year, it doesn't happen like that. That is gambling, might as well go to casino and dump 10K a hand on black or red. You'll double or nothing after 5min. It doesn't take an intelligent person to actually make money. Its your psychological that is more important. As an example, I was down -30% at 1 stage for my high risk stock, but I brought more! Now its ahead 260% :wink:
 

Runifyouhaveto

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Loyal
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