Serious Singapore investors have unrealistic income expectations: Schroders survey

SINGAPORE investors are an overly-optimistic lot, with the millennials here particularly more bullish and confident of their investment returns, a survey has found.

The average investor in the city-state expects a 9.2 per cent minimum return on their investments per year, according to the Schroders Global Investor Survey 2016. This is a stark contrast to the average stockmarket yield of only 3.8 per cent.

This over-optimism is more pronounced among millennials, who expect a 9.6 per cent return on their investment per year compared to 8.9 per cent for investors aged 36 and over.

"Singapore investors are overly optimistic about income returns," said Schroders on Wednesday.

Investors here also have a short-term investment view. While asset managers usually recommend a minimum of five years for investing, investors in Singapore stay invested for 3.06 years on average.

Millennials are even more short term-oriented. They hold their investments for an average of 2.61 years, compared to 3.47 years for their older counterparts.

Singapore investors appear to be very confident in their investment knowledge. More than half (55 per cent) describe themselves as having a higher-than-average understanding of investments. Millennials are even more self-confident, with 61 per cent of them agreeing to the statement, compared to 50 per cent by their older counterparts. Very few (11 per cent) of them feel they have less-than-average understanding.

"In today's low interest rate environment, Singapore investors' return projections are extremely high. In order to minimise income shortfall, investors need to actively consider their investment needs and align their risk-adjusted return profile in light of current market conditions," said Susan Soh, country head of Schroders Singapore.

The survey, commissioned by Schroders, was conducted online and sampled 20,000 end-investors in 28 countries around the world between March 20 and April 25. It defines "investors" as those who will be investing at least 10,000 euros (or equivalent) in the next 12 months and who have made changes to their investments within the last five years.

http://www.businesstimes.com.sg/gov..._medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&xtor=CS1-3

unrealistic. if i can earn 5% dividend on dividend stocks i'm happy.

eatshitndie said:

unrealistic. if i can earn 5% dividend on dividend stocks i'm happy.

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I belongs to the most realistic group. 2%return from risk free investment and 200 to 500% returns from high risk investment aka gambling.

chootchiew said:

I belongs to the most realistic group. 2%return from risk free investment and 200 to 500% returns from high risk investment aka gambling.

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Sounds like king of tcss. Well the truth is after averaging out the win and losses it usually workout to high risk returns of 10% :p

chootchiew said:

Sounds like king of tcss. Well the truth is after averaging out the win and losses it usually workout to high risk returns of 10% :p

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gambling is usually negative returns,more like negative 90 percent returns.

frenchbriefs said:

gambling is usually negative returns,more like negative 90 percent returns.

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Due to this most people would not bother to try out and most human are programmed to work hard for money, after all they would not feel proud and realistic . The majority.of gamblers want to win the whole casino or sg pool. That's where the difference lies. But I can only use this word "guaranteed" lifelong 10% from sg pool sports betting and not any other forms of gambling. I still gamble in turf club for the high returns but purely for entertainment. I play with $2 $5 bets so it's alright.

Oh, 9.2% expectation is too optimistic?

I just received a call last night promising me at least 10% yield, no sweat.

I told the caller I not interested, unless investment promise at least 50% returns. If so, I be interested to hear their scam stories.

That is because Schroders is such a lousy fund manager. Just look at the performance of their funds net of fees. Pathetic. Wonder how long they last.

Black Swan said:

That is because Schroders is such a lousy fund manager. Just look at the performance of their funds net of fees. Pathetic. Wonder how long they last.

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Yep, the performance of their funds sucks......
What's wrong with having high expectations......with the fees they are charging......
Might as well go for a diy and save on the fees going by their logic.....

eatshitndie said:

unrealistic. if i can earn 5% dividend on dividend stocks i'm happy.

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Just buy SPY and you can do better than 5%.

Sinkees are realistics ...they expect to get insider info like the PAP elites are cashing in on that all the time. So, their 9 percent return expectation is already a lowball. Look at the millionaires in the PAP pool ...if they can do it, sinkees think they can.

That's why John Tan spends so much time sucking up to the PAP ...hope that he is sucking up to the right person.

9% on 100K when you 100K is your life savings and you don't want to do any work because using money to make money must be the easiest thing on earth is unrealistic, but 9% in one month on 100K which is say 10% of your life savings most of which is in "safe" investments elsewhere is very doable. Try index futures day trading.

BTW fund managers always want to lower their clients' expectations so they can charge management fees based on AUM without any pressure from clients pulling out funds due to under-performance.

So, the good people at Schroders can go and fuck spider. :oIo::kma:

Highlights of StarDate 2816, 15th day of 9th month:

Missed trade when Hang Seng Index near month futures hit mid point (23325) between R1 and Pivot and gives a low close doji signal along with bearish divergences on my favourite indicators in my favourite time frames - still recovering from commute

- so many smart phone zombies and low life peasants in subway trains and just about everywhere else :oIo:

Buy2@23215@1004hours, B2@23196@1013
Sell2@23216@1016, S1@242@1023, S1@244@1024
Profit = HKD 4,850 on capital employed of about HKD 150K
3.2% return in less than half an hour
BTW, 23205 is the mid point between S1 and Pivot and a high close doji signal occurred, so it's not freak, scaling in and well capitalised account gives me confidence to go in (but too small a position in retrospect).

After missing opportunity to short at 23340 when reading some nonsense!
S4@23312@1448, S2@321@1451, S2@305@1502
What the fuck! Suddenly shoot up!
B20@23351@1507 from net short to net long 10 contracts
S5@23449@1517, S5@432@1518
Loss on shorts = HKD (19,000)
Profit on longs = HKD 44,750
Net profit on this "misadventure" = HKD 25,750

It's not a "misadventure" but my die die habit of trying to pick the top sabotaging me again! When the market makes a new intra day high in the afternoon and stays hovering there - the probability of it continuing to go up is very high - didn't my sifu teach me that and haven't I seen in many many times in my review of my "vast" database of intraday charts! :oIo:

Lucky I don't have loyalty in the early morning and after 3 pm in the afternoon (for reasons obvious to traders more seasoned than myself) and have no qualms about changing sides when the market gives me the signals! :kma:

Won't bore you with the details of the other trades, but result for entire day is profit of HKD 25,445 with 72 contracts traded and maximum of 12 contracts open at any one time, though most of the time is flat and bored

About 3% return on capital employed of HKD 850K in one very boring day lah!

Asterix said:

9% on 100K when you 100K is your life savings and you don't want to do any work because using money to make money must be the easiest thing on earth is unrealistic, but 9% in one month on 100K which is say 10% of your life savings most of which is in "safe" investments elsewhere is very doable. Try index futures day trading,,,,

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I've got about US$50,000 that I want to invest in the US market. This is from profits from some other investments. I don't need this money because this is a surplus. I can keep it in the bank for 1% to 2% interest rate, or look at buying a cheap condo in Thailand, or .....

Looking for recommendations on where I can put this $ to generate more $$.

1) I do not have any SFC licence for type 4 (investment advice) activity.
2) Can't give advice without knowing background info like age, personality, time frame, etc.
3) Don't like to do anything for free

Also, am concentrating on improving my index futures day trading. My first trade of yesterday suffers from a problem that is plaguing me - I get out too soon especially on my long trades. This means I am by nature a pessimistic person

I hardly look at the daily or hourly charts and with the new half minute charts in my software I have become too focused on the small swings and often miss the big picture. I am actually surprised that I can make consistent profit - for September so far, every day has been profitable. In fact only Wednesday afternoon's session has been a loss, but still profitable for the whole of Wednesday.

Asterix said:

9% on 100K when you 100K is your life savings and you don't want to do any work because using money to make money must be the easiest thing on earth is unrealistic, but 9% in one month on 100K which is say 10% of your life savings most of which is in "safe" investments elsewhere is very doable. Try index futures day trading.

BTW fund managers always want to lower their clients' expectations so they can charge management fees based on AUM without any pressure from clients pulling out funds due to under-performance.

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uh 95% of people fail at trading too so i dont think thats very good advice,better to try poker instead,higher probability of success maybe 80% fail 20% succeed.better stick to the safer more guaranteed 6 to 8% a year returns of index funds and equities.

Asterix said:

1) I do not have any SFC licence for type 4 (investment advice) activity.
2) Can't give advice without knowing background info like age, personality, time frame, etc.
3) Don't like to do anything for free

Also, am concentrating on improving my index futures day trading. My first trade of yesterday suffers from a problem that is plaguing me - I get out too soon especially on my long trades. This means I am by nature a pessimistic person

I hardly look at the daily or hourly charts and with the new half minute charts in my software I have become too focused on the small swings and often miss the big picture. I am actually surprised that I can make consistent profit - for September so far, every day has been profitable. In fact only Wednesday afternoon's session has been a loss, but still profitable for the whole of Wednesday.

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I'm getting lazy in my old age
Looking for something where I don't have to closely monitor. I don't expect high returns just looking for something that will give a higher return than what the banks are giving(1 to 2%).

The US$50k is already in my US trading account & not generating $. Probably look into one or more of the ETFs or one of the many dividend stocks.

johnny333 said:

I've got about US$50,000 that I want to invest in the US market. This is from profits from some other investments. I don't need this money because this is a surplus. I can keep it in the bank for 1% to 2% interest rate, or look at buying a cheap condo in Thailand, or .....

Looking for recommendations on where I can put this $ to generate more $$.

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Get some etf. I suggest vts. Warren buffet has a bet with a fund manager that etf will out perform any funds in the long run. He is 68% ahead now while the funds are only like 20%. If you want to punt, play what you can afford to lose. My recent punt us now 150% ahead after a year.

johnny333 said:

I'm getting lazy in my old age
Looking for something where I don't have to closely monitor. I don't expect high returns just looking for something that will give a higher return than what the banks are giving(1 to 2%).

The US$50k is already in my US trading account & not generating $. Probably look into one or more of the ETFs or one of the many dividend stocks.

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Don't forget some etfs do oay out dividened based on the index it tracks as well.

winnipegjets said:

Sinkees are realistics ...they expect to get insider info like the PAP elites are cashing in on that all the time. So, their 9 percent return expectation is already a lowball. Look at the millionaires in the PAP pool ...if they can do it, sinkees think they can.

That's why John Tan spends so much time sucking up to the PAP ...hope that he is sucking up to the right person.

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The PAP dick I am sucking is long and hard. It won't go limp so easily like David Ong's.

My other income from rental, dividends and rubber-stamping director fees has provided me with good streams of multiple incomes. I don't spend the salary that I pay myself for being towkay of my own company.

Sinkies should spend more time building up multiple streams of income instead of putting all their eggs into one basket which is their jobs. Little wonder why so many of them become destitute the moment they get retrenched and replaced by a cheaper, better and faster foreign worker.

Will be useful later .........

https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/