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Thread: Crumbling of Singapore?

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    The corruption index is compiled by organisation that has no vested interest in the PAP. I'm sure they would be able to see through any smokescreen. The fact remains that an external organisation ranks the Singapore govt highly. If you doubt the credibility of the results, then you have to doubt the rankings of all the other countries too.
    How was the compilation done? Where were the sources of the statistics?

    Foreigners have been singing praises of Singapore...they only experienced SG as a visitor and as a foreigner. Many people who write for foreign presses get their data and statistics from govt agencies and GLOs..they didnt stay long enough to experience what Singaporeans go through and so what they wrote are not credible...work in SG for some years, feel the pressure and then comment..speak with some credibility.

    Look at Robert Murdoch..commenting on SG..what does he know abt SG? from what he read and saw on pics...is that credible? he probably havent visited SG..it was best for him to keep his mouth shut
    Last edited by TracyTan866; 16-12-2011 at 01:26 AM.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by TracyTan866 View Post
    The pap rewards a former MOS and puts him as CEO of ComfortDelgro and pays him $1.54m per year to run a taxi fleet..Poor taxi drivers have to play 10hr days to pay for exhorbitant taxi rentals of $97 per day to pay for the magmt board's salaries...Is that legal?- Yes...Is that moral? -no..is that corrupt?..u tell me
    It may not be an ideal situation but similar scenarios exist the world over. That's what the "Occupy" protest movement is all about. Wall Street is full of overpaid CEOs who don't deserve their obscene salaries too and the same story is repeated in many European countries.

    Singapore is in no way perfect and there is a lot that can be done to improve things. However, Singapore's flaws must be viewed in context. The world is an imperfect place and injustice exists everywhere. When it comes to quantifying things, Singapore invariably comes out very high up so it must be doing many things right. It's a matter of working hard to improve things further instead of just moaning all the time.

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  3. #23
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    It may not be an ideal situation but similar scenarios exist the world over. That's what the "Occupy" protest movement is all about. Wall Street is full of overpaid CEOs who don't deserve their obscene salaries too. It's the same story in many European countries too.

    Singapore is in no way perfect and there is a lot that can be done to improve things. However, Singapore's flaws must be viewed in context. The world is an imperfect place and injustices exist everywhere. When it comes to quantifying things, Singapore invariably comes out very high up so it must be doing many things right.
    At least you concede that SG is imperfect...certainly not wonderful as you had trumpeted and tried to run ppl like me down.

    You are entitled to your utopian view of SG and I respect that...but please respect my view of an imperfect Sg that needs change soon and not try to run me down. Likewise I respect a foreigner's view if they think SG is wonderful but they shd not try to run Singaporeans down and paint them as ignorant or ungrateful because they dont experience what Singaporeans go through and are in no position to comment on Singaporeans

    I am passionate abt SG's future as I love SG and am concerned abt Singaporeans' future and am doing in my own small way to articulate how I feel abt the SG system which is killing many singaporeans and benefiting the well connected..to me that's wrong
    Last edited by TracyTan866; 16-12-2011 at 01:32 AM.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    over exaggeration. i've been riding the mrt for the past week and am impressed with the new circle line. it helps divert traffic away from the downtown area, namely city hall and raffles place stations. there are now more alternate routes to take if you're going east to northeast or east to north or east to harbor front, or similarly from west to these same end points. not all traffic needs to go thru' the hubs at city hall or raffles place like before. moreover, there are new stops such as bartley, farrer park, caldecott, holland village, botanic gardens, etc. all these improvements in 2 years? in comparison, the bay area rapid transit is still doing studies on a future extension to san jose from fremont after getting initial go ahead via balloting and preliminary funding of the project back in 2008. nothing is done so far except soil and environmental impact studies, including examination and avoidance of possible native american burial sites. no ground for any rail extension and new station construction will be broken until 2016, which by then will bloat the budget 5 to 8 times based on current price tag. if it finally were to get started in 2016, the completion of the last station in san jose would be sometime in 2020, bloating the budget even bigger by 10 to 12 times. by then, voters would not be able to stomach more budget increases and may pass measures to cancel or delay it. future technology and design of tracks and trains may also render construction and carriages based on current designs obsolete. population and traffic flows may outstrip current projections. price per ride today is based on distance covered, and it's high at more than 5 bucks from fremont to sf one-way with 1 lousy buck for parking...totaling 11 bucks for a round trip fare. train interval is 15 minutes during peak and 20 minutes off peak. carriages are filthy and stinky, old and clunky. doors break down often and require a mechanical technician 30 minutes later to inspect before having an electrical technician to show up 30 minutes later to fix problems. breakdowns due to door issues will need at least an hour to diffuse before the next train arrives as rescue train. track problems occur daily and delays can last hours. sinkies should consider themselves lucky for having the most efficient and well designed mrt network in the world.

    the public wireless broadband network based on wifi, on the other hand, in sg sucks so much that i don't have anymore knnbccb expletives to throw at it.
    6.9 k's of sinkies: kopi, kaya toast, kueh kueh, kio kway, ktv, kpkb.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by TracyTan866 View Post
    Look at Robert Murdoch..commenting on SG..what does he know abt SG? from what he read and saw on pics...is that credible? he probably havent visited SG..it was best for him to keep his mouth shut
    As I said earlier, if you question the methodology, then the results aren't credible at all and every country's ranking is in doubt.

    If Rupert Murdoch isn't qualified because he hasn't been there, then I am eminently qualified because I spent 40 years in Singapore, 10 years in Australia and 5 years in NZ and I can categorically state that if you measure the bottom line, the Singapore govt is the best that I have experienced when it comes to getting things done and done quickly.

    In NZ, they've been talking about building an MRT system for THIRTY YEARS and they still haven't installed the first metre of track. In Auckland, there is no MRT to go wrong in the first place.

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  6. #26
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by TracyTan866 View Post
    At least you concede that SG is imperfect...certainly not wonderful as you had trumpeted and tried to run ppl like me down.
    Tell me where in any of my responses I have tried to "run you down". All I've been doing is pointing out that by world standards, Singapore is a great place to live and the govt is very efficient and honest compared to most other governments.

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  7. #27
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    As I said earlier, if you question the methodology, then the results aren't credible at all and every country's ranking is in doubt.

    If Rupert Murdoch isn't qualified because he hasn't been there, then I am eminently qualified because I spent 40 years in Singapore, 10 years in Australia and 5 years in NZ and I can categorically state that if you measure the bottom line, the Singapore govt is the best that I have experienced when it comes to getting things done and done quickly.

    In NZ, they've been talking about building an MRT system for THIRTY YEARS and they still haven't installed the first metre of track. In Auckland, there is no MRT to go wrong in the first place.
    I differ from you. I have travelled much and I think the aus and NZ govts govern their countries excellently.

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by TracyTan866 View Post
    I differ from you. I have travelled much and I think the aus and NZ govts govern their countries excellently.
    Travelling is different from living in a country. I comment only on places I have actually lived in for a considerable period of time.

    If you think waiting 30 years for an MRT system which will probably NEVER materialise is better than a modern system that breaks down once in a while, then I have nothing further to say. It appears that your definition of "excellent" is different from mine.

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  9. #29
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    Tell me where in any of my responses I have tried to "run you down". All I've been doing is pointing out that by world standards, Singapore is a great place to live and the govt is very efficient and honest compared to most other governments.
    Are you saying that you have been agreeing with what I said all along?

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    Travelling is different from actually living in a country. I comment only on places I have actually lived in for a considerable period of time.

    If you think waiting 30 years for an MRT system which will probably NEVER materialise is better than a modern system that breaks down once in a while, then I have nothing further to say. It appears that your definition of "excellent" is different from mine.
    "the govt is very efficient and honest compared to most other governments."

    Unlike you, I dont compare SG govt with third rate govts, after all its salary is not comparable to any govt..I rate the pap for what it does and what it is...and have I not listed enough of what it did to convince you that it's not a clean and honest govt?
    Last edited by TracyTan866; 16-12-2011 at 01:51 AM.

  11. #31
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    If you think waiting 30 years for an MRT system which will probably NEVER materialise is better than a modern system that breaks down once in a while, then I have nothing further to say. It appears that your definition of "excellent" is different from mine.
    Why is there a need for MRT in Christchurch?

  12. #32
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    If you think waiting 30 years for an MRT system which will probably NEVER materialise is better than a modern system that breaks down once in a while, then I have nothing further to say. It appears that your definition of "excellent" is different from mine.

    You missed the big picture..It's not abt an MRT breakdown.

    It's abt the mismanagement of SG and the eventual crumbling of SG .
    Last edited by TracyTan866; 16-12-2011 at 01:59 AM.

  13. #33
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by TracyTan866 View Post
    I differ from you. I have travelled much and I think the aus and NZ govts govern their countries excellently.
    I have to agree with Leongsam on this. Many of my friends who had went overseas to stay for 5 years or more, all came back appreciating more what PAP had done. We are not talking about 3rd world countries but US and Canada.

  14. #34
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by TracyTan866 View Post
    "the govt is very efficient and honest compared to most other governments."

    Unlike you, I dont compare SG govt with third rate govts, after all its salary is not comparable to any govt..I rate the pap for what it does and what it is...and have I not listed enough of what it did to convince you that it's not a clean and honest govt?
    I'm not comparing the SG governments with 3rd rate governments either. I'm comparing it with 1st world governments.

    Take the NZ government for example. Successive governments [labour and national] have squandered huge amounts of money on so called "treaty settlements" which is a politically correct term used to describe the process of "bribing Maori in return for votes". Total settlements to date total more than ONE BILLION NZD and there is no end in sight.

    This squandering of taxpayer and ratepayer money doesn't stop there. The so called "Maori Statutory Board", an unelected group of freeloaders, costs the ratepayer (me) 3.2 million dollars a year. What do I get in return??? Advice on Maori "culture" and practices in the development of the Auckland region.

    Until you have lived in a country as a taxpayer and ratepayer, you are not qualified to comment on how "excellent" the governance of the place is.

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  15. #35
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    I'm not comparing the SG governments with 3rd rate governments either. I'm comparing it with 1st world governments.

    Take the NZ goverment for example. Successive governments have squandered huge amounts of money on so called "treaty settlements" which is a politically correct term used in place of "bribing Maori in return for votes". Total settlements today total more than ONE BILLION NZD and there is no end in sight.

    This squandering of taxpayer and ratepayer money doesn't stop there. The so called "Maori Statutory Board", an unelected group of freeloaders, cost the ratepayer (me) 3.2 million dollars a year. What do I get in return??? Advice on Maori "culture" and practices in the development of the Auckland region.

    Until you have lived in a country as a taxpayer and ratepayer, you are not qualified to comment on how "excellent" the governance of the place is.
    I am not comparing the pap with any govt because based on salaries it's beyond comparison. so dont compare..it's meaningless.

    let's talk abt the performance of the pap..

  16. #36
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by TracyTan866 View Post
    You missed the big picture..It's not abt an MRT breakdown.

    It's abt the mismanagement of SG and the eventual crumbling of SG .
    I have to say once again that you don't know what "mismanagement" is till you've lived in the so called first world countries that you admire so much.

    As for "eventual crumbling", nothing lasts forever. The Roman Empire crumbled and so did "Great" Britain. The onus is on the citizens to ensure that the eventual decline is put off for as long as possible.

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  17. #37
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    I have to say once again that you don't know what "mismanagement" is till you've lived in the so called first world countries that you admire so much.
    I have to say again that you dont know how the pap has mismanaged SG until you know more abt what they do and not what you read
    Last edited by TracyTan866; 16-12-2011 at 02:08 AM.

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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

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  19. #39
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leongsam View Post
    If you think waiting 30 years for an MRT system which will probably NEVER materialise is better than a modern system that breaks down once in a while, then I have nothing further to say. It appears that your definition of "excellent" is different from mine.
    Refer to my 1st post in this thread...it was never the MRT breakdown that is the main issue...the pap praises itself as excellent. I am listing why I disagree..do you agree with the pap's praise of itself as excellent?

  20. #40
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    Default Re: Crumbling of Singapore?

    Quote Originally Posted by TracyTan866 View Post
    I am not comparing the pap with any govt because based on salaries it's beyond comparison. so dont compare..it's meaningless.
    You can't compare salaries of individuals within government. You have to compare how much the whole government bureaucracy costs the nation as a percentage of its GDP.

    NZ has so many layers of government that it costs an absolute bomb. To start with, there are 120 MPs in a country with a population smaller than Singapore's that generates a GDP only HALF that of Singapore.

    The PM earns less than LHL but each MP earns at least 50% more than a Singapore MP. I also pay for the "FREE" air travel of these clowns all over NZ.

    My taxes also have to support a huge local government empire.

    My estimate is that the NZ government (local plus national) costs the taxpayer at least DOUBLE what the Singapore govt costs for half the output.

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