Jai Hind! Air India flight carrying 242 people heading for London crashes #PrayforCECA

sbfuncle said:
This data you found is taking the present number of flights.
Did you managed to get the data on the flight world wide per day vs the car driving off per day worldwide?

I couldn't get this data.
But I believe the number difference is like what you mentioned, a drop In the bucket, so I assume plane could be more danger or perhaps same as a car.

If we take your data, it simply means we are delaying the death count of a plane.
The actual risk factor has not been taken into account.
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Some time ago, I ran across these numbers computed by some aviation authority. Can't be bothered to remember who, what, when.

What i did remember was car trips are more dangerous by kms travelled, but when you switch it to trips taken, planes became more dangerous.

In any case, a car fatality is a relatively short term event. Seconds and sometimes they don't even know what him them. Contrast that with the plane free-falling or in uncontrolled flight for minutes. No thanks.
 
oliverlee said:
dont blame Boeing. your fucking kind can't fly a kite for Modi's sake.
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I hope you're wrong. SIA is known by many internally as Singapore Indian Association because of so many Indians in it. Used to have an Indian in charge for the longest time. Dhanabalan was it?
 
nightsafari said:
Some time ago, I ran across these numbers computed by some aviation authority. Can't be bothered to remember who, what, when.

What i did remember was car trips are more dangerous by kms travelled, but when you switch it to trips taken, planes became more dangerous.

In any case, a car fatality is a relatively short term event. Seconds and sometimes they don't even know what him them. Contrast that with the plane free-falling or in uncontrolled flight for minutes. No thanks.
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Thanks for pointing this out.
It make sense that when we go by the km travelled, car will be a more dangerous vehicle.
I always have this thought that even plane can be a dangerous mode of transportation, aviation companies will not publish it and cause fear.
 
sbfuncle said:
Thanks for pointing this out.
It make sense that when we go by the km travelled, car will be a more dangerous vehicle.
I always have this thought that even plane can be a dangerous mode of transportation, aviation companies will not publish it and cause fear.
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quite right. which is why they love to publish event per km which is in their favour. if you do km per trip, suddenly a car becomes better. They never publicly acknowledge the 2nd statistic and love to push the 1st.

Having said that, if pilot properly trained and plane properly maintained, I have no problem. It's when there are shortcuts to either problems go wrong. There are idiot pilots, idiot plane mfrs and idiot plane maintenance co's. when it comes to failures, cars tend to be not be as big a problem.

Car engine break down? Lan lan, go sit at the side of the road wait for tow truck. Plane engine break down? Sit where?

Car driver idiot? Maybe accident take himself and passengers (2-3) out maybe another vehicle and 3-4 passengers. Pilot idiot? Hundreds if not more.
 
nightsafari said:
That's not entirely correct.

Our reality is determined by quantum mechanics. Probability is the best way we have of DESCRIBING/ESTIMATING the behaviour of our universe at the quantum level. Probability is NOT the underlying physical law of our reality nor does it DETERMINE the behaviour of quantum particles.

As of now, no one understands HOW quantum mechanics is determined, but only that it is best described in a probabilistic sense. In fact, I would go out on a limb and say you might as well say our universe is more easily determined by observation rather than probability because it has shown to have a positive determining effect on particle behaviour.
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At the quantum scale, probability is fundamental. The laws of physics, described by quantum mechanics, govern the behavior of particles through wave functions. These wave functions give probabilities for outcomes.

If you can understand entropy you'll realise that it's all about probability which is why a broken bottle cannot reassemble although it is theoretically possible it is just so improbable that it has never been observed.
 
nightsafari said:
Some time ago, I ran across these numbers computed by some aviation authority. Can't be bothered to remember who, what, when.

What i did remember was car trips are more dangerous by kms travelled, but when you switch it to trips taken, planes became more dangerous.

In any case, a car fatality is a relatively short term event. Seconds and sometimes they don't even know what him them. Contrast that with the plane free-falling or in uncontrolled flight for minutes. No thanks.
Click to expand...

The reason why I used trips taken as the defining parameter is because it relates to our reality. We want to know which act is more likely to kill us... getting on a plane or getting into a car.

The data I got indicates that planes are safer both in km travelled and in trips taken vs the car.
 
Leongsam said:
At the quantum scale, probability is fundamental. The laws of physics, described by quantum mechanics, govern the behavior of particles through wave functions. These wave functions give probabilities for outcomes.
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no it's not. ever heard of the double slit experiment. I would happily argue with you that observation is more fundamental. Probabilities in quantum mechanics are subservient to observation.
Leongsam said:
If you can understand entropy you'll realise that it's all about probability which is why a broken bottle cannot reassemble although it is theoretically possible it is just so improbable that it has never been observed.
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entropy is a law of physics. a fundamental one. the only way I see probability having to do with entropy is in describing it in one of the theories used in understanding entropy and how it behaves. It doesn't cause entropy. Just like it doesn't cause quantum mechanics. It has absolutely nothing to do with the entropy itself. As an analogy, you seem to be suggesting that a patient's chart determines how he gets the disease. It certainly tells you a lot of information, but it doesn't always tell you how he got it in the 1st place.
 
Leongsam said:
The reason why I used trips taken as the defining parameter is because it relates to our reality. We want to know which act is more likely to kill us... getting on a plane or getting into a car.

The data I got indicates that planes are safer both in km travelled and in trips taken vs the car.
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I've no issue with this. I totally agree and I too believe that trips taken is a better statistic.

Other than for the fact that I came across data on trips taken which suggests the opposite of your findings. But then again, I cannot confirm nor deny your sources or mine. Mine is unverifiable, I ran across it some time ago. And I cannot verify yours. c'est la vie.
 
nightsafari said:
no it's not. ever heard of the double slit experiment. I would happily argue with you that observation is more fundamental. Probabilities in quantum mechanics are subservient to observation.

entropy is a law of physics. a fundamental one. the only way I see probability having to do with entropy is in describing it in one of the theories used in understanding entropy and how it behaves. It doesn't cause entropy. Just like it doesn't cause quantum mechanics. It has absolutely nothing to do with the entropy itself. As an analogy, you seem to be suggesting that a patient's chart determines how he gets the disease. It certainly tells you a lot of information, but it doesn't always tell you how he got it in the 1st place.
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Heard of the double slit experiment?... yes when I was 18 years old. :D

You do realise that "observation" is actually interference. Probabilities determine the wave function observation does not. All that observation does is force it to choose one state out of many possibilities that the wave function describes.
 
nightsafari said:
I've no issue with this. I totally agree and I too believe that trips taken is a better statistic.

Other than for the fact that I came across data on trips taken which suggests the opposite of your findings. But then again, I cannot confirm nor deny your sources or mine. Mine is unverifiable, I ran across it some time ago. And I cannot verify yours. c'est la vie.
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I got my data using AI. Of course it could be wrong. I have corrected many mistakes that AI has made and it has apologised to me and promised to do better! :)
 
Leongsam said:
I got my data using AI. Of course it could be wrong. I have corrected many mistakes that AI has made and it has apologised to me and promised to do better! :)
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ai sometimes outright lies. It's a convenience feature with bugs. It's hardly intelligence.
 
Leongsam said:
Heard of the double slit experiment?... yes when I was 18 years old. :D

You do realise that "observation" is actually interference. Probabilities determine the wave function observation does not. All that observation does is force it to choose one state out of many possibilities that the wave function describes.
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Here, let me illustrate my point :

"Probabilities determine describe the wave function"

Something which you yourself say. We don't actually know what in the world determines quantum mechanics only that we can most accurately depict some of the behaviours in a probabilistic manner.

heypi?
 
nightsafari said:
Here, let me illustrate my point :

"Probabilities determine describe the wave function"

Something which you yourself say. We don't actually know what in the world determines quantum mechanics only that we can most accurately depict some of the behaviours in a probabilistic manner.

heypi?
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I'm no genius. I just find the subject enthralling and it keeps my mind working as age advances.

In my opinion nobody knows what's going on just a whole lot of theories.

However Bell's inequality certainly seems to show that entanglement is real which in itself is mind boggling. How the hell does one particle a million km away know what has just happened to its buddy?
 
Leongsam said:
I'm no genius. I just find the subject enthralling and it keeps my mind working as age advances.
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And I'm just trying to keep you honest instead of allowing you to ride over everyone else with your knowledge. :biggrin:
Leongsam said:
In my opinion nobody knows what's going on just a whole lot of theories.
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yup.
Leongsam said:
However Bell's inequality certainly seems to show that entanglement is real which in itself is mind boggling. How the hell does one particle a million km away know what has just happened to its buddy?
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I'm actually terrible at complex notation and I have a very finite memory, so I skip it. I do focus on theory, validity and principles.

How the hell? No one knows. But it's proven and most remarkably as far as I'm concerned, defy relativity and causality. There are arguments out there saying it doesn't defy relativity, but they sound like fancy tai chi just to prove that it doesn't.

With quantum entanglement, things like psychic communication suddenly have a plausible explanation. Some people describe instantly knowing of another's death without being near or informed. This would be it.

And along the same lines, dipping our foot into quantum computing is positively mind-boggling. It's like science fiction of the highest order and I suspect that true AI would be achievable only with quantum computing rather than the information aggregator we have today.
 
Leongsam said:
The reason why I used trips taken as the defining parameter is because it relates to our reality. We want to know which act is more likely to kill us... getting on a plane or getting into a car.

The data I got indicates that planes are safer both in km travelled and in trips taken vs the car.
Click to expand...
probability has turned into professors talk.
I will have to exit :confused:
Before that can I ask you, if according to your data, the probability of a plane crash is so low until the point of

Flying (Commercial Airlines): The risk of death is approximately 0.000009% per trip (1 in 11 million flights, based on global aviation data).
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How do you explain the past few mths crashes? There were quite a handful of it
 
nightsafari said:
And along the same lines, dipping our foot into quantum computing is positively mind-boggling. It's like science fiction of the highest order and I suspect that true AI would be achievable only with quantum computing rather than the information aggregator we have today.
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I believe that "consciousness" is quantum not chemical or electrical as was previously thought.

In our brains is stored ALL our memories from the age of about 3 to the present day. There's stuff there that you don't even know existed until something jolts it ie a song, a smell or a scene or a sound. There is no way that so much information can exist other than at quantum level.
 
sbfuncle said:
probability has turned into professors talk.
I will have to exit :confused:
Before that can I ask you, if according to your data, the probability of a plane crash is so low until the point of



How do you explain the past few mths crashes? There were quite a handful of it
Click to expand...

There are crashes on a regular basis but nowadays social media brings them to the forefront and keeps them there for weeks with every mother's son coming out with his own theory, making videos about their theories and arguing about why they are right and everyone else is wrong just as we are doing now. :D

Most plane crashes involve smaller planes and are not newsworthy.
 
nightsafari said:
I hope you're wrong. SIA is known by many internally as Singapore Indian Association because of so many Indians in it. Used to have an Indian in charge for the longest time. Dhanabalan was it?
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And SIA, the Temasick owned airline, owns 25 percent of Air India. Everything Indian smells trouble.
 
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