Spain Plunders 90% Of Social Security Fund To Buy Its Own Debt

[neddy]

Spanish people is idiot.

The Spanish are not one united homogeneous people, so like many multi-ethnic groups, they have arguments..
It is not just the ETA wanting independence, people from the Catalonian region want independence as well.

 

[neddy]

I just told you. You tell me where I got it wrong. You sure you wanna play?

I am curious. Just answer my question. I am getting Spanish residency visa soon

 

[Kinana]

I am curious. Just answer my question. I am getting Spanish residency visa soon

I already told you. You can't read and follow the thread?
Now you answer my question. Where did I go wrong?

 

[watchman8]

They joined the Euro, enjoyed its stability and borrowed money to fund welfare, thats the problem.
The inflexibilty does affect competition but aren't we talking about debt now? Looks like you really didn't know much about Spanish economy

If Spain has to pay real market rate to finance their budget deficit, they would have adjusted their expenditures long ago before this became a crisis. They would also have depreciated their currency to stay competitive with china and India, and many spaniards would still have a job to finance their pension system. Instead the euro screwed them totally by allowing the Spanish govt to continue borrowing huge amounts at low interest rate to finance deficits, and at same time continue to lose jobs to china and India, which further accelerated deficit size.

 

[Fook Seng]

Spain's Social Security Reserve Fund is a bit like Singapore CPF, except CPF comes from members' contributions. The Spain version comes from welfare surplus.

In Spain, there is state pension, and any shortfall is met with the Social Security Reserve Fund.

In Singapore, there is no state pension, except for MIW. Therefore, everyone need CPF

In any case, it is money that eventually should go to the people.

 

[neddy]

Instead the euro screwed them totally by allowing the Spanish govt to continue borrowing huge amounts at low interest rate to finance deficits, and at same time continue to lose jobs to china and India, which further accelerated deficit size.

It is not the EURO screwing them. At least within the Euro system, the politicians are more restricted in what they can do.

If they have been running their own currency, the economy would have collapsed long ago. Because there is no one to stop them running the economy to the ground.
Why, the problem is with their corrupt and infighting politicians.

 

[Fook Seng]

the PAP is plundering the CPF to support its debt too............

you will be shocked that we are as bad as Greece.... except nothing has happened so far for anyone to "adjust" their ratings...

Both are money that eventually should go back to the people. In fact, it is more so for our CPF which is already our money but kept by the Govt. In the case of Spain, it is something that is only allocated and can be withdrawn if necessary.

Regarding country risk rating, in the case of Spain, the people will descend into a frenzy if they miss their welfare benefits. As for us Sinkies, we will lower our heads instead and diam diam accept a further deferment of our CPF withdrawal and continue to vote next time in the GE strongly for the Pappies. What is new? This alone accounts for the difference in rating of the two countries.

 

[neddy]

Both are money that eventually should go back to the people.

The money is spent (for the people) ahead of retirement ?

 

[watchman8]

It is not the EURO screwing them. At least within the Euro system, the politicians are more restricted in what they can do.

If they have been running their own currency, the economy would have collapsed long ago. Because there is no one to stop them running the economy to the ground.
Why, the problem is with their corrupt and infighting politicians.

If they had not taken up euro, their currency would have depreciated much earlier under bad govt. that would have several beneficial effect. First is the people will be forced to pick a better govt. second, their economy would be more competitive and more spaniards would continue to hold jobs.

The euro screw them because Germany strong exports meant that euro remained too strong for Spain. At same time, the market continued to buy Spanish bonds at super low rates, thereby lulling the govt and people into thinking that all is well. The deficit continued to balloon for a long time and suddenly the interest rate shot up when everyone realize the euro zone is not going to save Spain.

Now, you tell me, what has welfare system got to do with this? Welfare was artificially propped up with artificially low interest rate, but welfare itself is not the cause of Spain crisis. Welfare is merely the expenditure that shot up when the euro resulted in many job loses.

 

[Kinana]

Both are money that eventually should go back to the people. In fact, it is more so for our CPF which is already our money but kept by the Govt. In the case of Spain, it is something that is only allocated and can be withdrawn if necessary.

Regarding country risk rating, in the case of Spain, the people will descend into a frenzy if they miss their welfare benefits. As for us Sinkies, we will lower our heads instead and diam diam accept a further deferment of our CPF withdrawal and continue to vote next time in the GE strongly for the Pappies. What is new? This alone accounts for the difference in rating of the two countries.

You want our country to become like Spain where the people are jobless n eating from rubbish bins now?

 

[cass888]

Are you an idiot or what? Most people do not have much money in their CPF. The CPF money has been PAID (i.e. point of no return) to Hong Leong, Far East, Capital Land and HDB. Only about 25% of the CPF is left in the account.

the PAP is plundering the CPF to support its debt too.

jyst do a quick check yourself and find out how leveraged is this country vs its national debt.....

you will be shocked that we are as bad as Greece.... except nothing has happened so far for anyone to "adjust" their ratings...

 

[johnny333]

You want our country to become like Spain where the people are jobless n eating from rubbish bins now?

How do you know that Spore is not in the same boat as the spansh?

Where is your documented proof that things are better here

 

[Kinana]

Are you an idiot or what? Most people do not have much money in their CPF. The CPF money has been PAID (i.e. point of no return) to Hong Leong, Far East, Capital Land and HDB. Only about 25% of the CPF is left in the account.

Really boy? Do you have any evidence to back up your claim sir?

 

[wMulew]

http://www.indexmundi.com/singapore/public_debt.html

118% of GDP.....

Dumbfuck opposition supporting retard. SG debt is all CPF. Greece and other EU debts does not include social welfare obligations. If we go by EU logic, SG will have 0 public debt

 

[cass888]

Slight change. Should be 63%, not 75%.

Very simple. That is what goes into the Ordinary account with a cap of $1,150.00 - that will be used to pay for your house - Hong Leong, Capital Land, Far East or HDB. So the forumer is stupid to say that CPF stole it.

Really boy? Do you have any evidence to back up your claim sir?

 

[neddy]

Dumbfuck opposition supporting retard. SG debt is all CPF. Greece and other EU debts does not include social welfare obligations. If we go by EU logic, SG will have 0 public debt

In Singapore, social welfare is for the rich. Those unproductive rich who do not contribute to new money, just sit around shake leg - wait for rental money to come in.

Maybe it is a good thing that those poor people who do not get welfare and left to die prematurely, saving the country and people a lot of money.

 

[lifeafter41]

Are you an idiot or what? Most people do not have much money in their CPF. The CPF money has been PAID (i.e. point of no return) to Hong Leong, Far East, Capital Land and HDB. Only about 25% of the CPF is left in the account.

The first to exit is probably the best.

Having said that, Singaporean could just sell their house, pack up and migrate.
Staying in 5 room, easily worth half million or more, couple with whatever leftover in CPF, just take off and leave.

Australia, Canada, New Zealand, Thailand, US of A, Malaysia or even Spain, here we come.

 

[LordElrond]

They are painted into a corner with their welfare spending and resultant debt.
Thats what happens when political parties win elections by promising people welfare.
the coming rash will be horrible.
The best thing to do is for Germany to leave the Euro.

And you believe in your own shit?

 

[The_Hypocrite]

But the funny thing is there are still countries that want to join the Euro..like those Eastern European ones,,,they are like the 60%,,just cant wait to be shafted

If Spain has to pay real market rate to finance their budget deficit, they would have adjusted their expenditures long ago before this became a crisis. They would also have depreciated their currency to stay competitive with china and India, and many spaniards would still have a job to finance their pension system. Instead the euro screwed them totally by allowing the Spanish govt to continue borrowing huge amounts at low interest rate to finance deficits, and at same time continue to lose jobs to china and India, which further accelerated deficit size.

 

[Fook Seng]

You want our country to become like Spain where the people are jobless n eating from rubbish bins now?

That is exactly the question I am trying to ask.