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Tough to be an immigrant in a minority community

PTADER

Alfrescian
Loyal
Don't worry, nothing more will be revealed. There are dishonourable lines that I do not cross. Happy 2010. PTADER.

*************************************************

Source: 147th, 11 Sep 1989

Tough to be an immigrant in a minority community

Time to provide Singaporeans with reasons to stay

WHY do Singaporeans emigrate? For that matter why does anybody?

Why do they uproot their families and leave familiar environs to settle in a n alien place where they, their offspring and descendants will eternally be in the minority - despite history's lessons on the fate of minority races?

Economic hardship and political suppression provide some good reasons. Another important one, especially in the past, was the promise of a better life when there were fewer and less rigid national boundaries, and new lands waited to be discovered and developed. But why emigrate now when Singapore is so well off materially?

Long ago, I convinced myself that leaving Singapore for the fabled cities of invigorating Vancouver, laissez faire London, easy-going Perth, or vibrant Los Angeles was out. Study of the human race's genocidal proclivities strengthens that conviction...

Yet people wittingly collect their loved ones to go some place where they may be welcomed momentarily (fleetingly in historical terms) with, I submit, insufficient thought about what may happen 10, 20, 40 years down the road, or the lot of their future generations ... in an age when national and racial boundaries have been firmly drawn.

Not long ago, I had one of the best years of my life as a temporary denizen of London.

There was not enough time to do what I had wanted to, nor to savour the plethora of cultural offerings of that exciting city ... historical sites, artifacts that even their original host countries could not match, theatres with the world's top artistes not available or too exorbitant elsewhere, diversions and attractions for the most narcissistic, and a tolerance of free speech symbolised by the Sunday sideshows of Hyde Park Corner.

What a magnificent place to be a part of, what agreeable pleasures for Anglophiles and Western-oriented gentlemen!

At the end of my year I foreswore settlement in London.

Great for a year's stay. But not home for an onion-skin (they call us yellow ) Chinese Singaporean.

No Asian Singaporean could ever truly belong in Anglo-Saxon England, despite

the inroads of the West Indians, and other Asians. We are a different species.

Recent reports of racial trouble there confirm they will never be accepted, and hint at the troubles to come (former Conservative MP Enoch Powell, like all prophets, was not accepted in his own country, nor in his time).

Hardly any salvation for minority races

The pogrom is not that far off... 50 years, 100 years, 500 years at the most.

Salvation for minority races and the rest of the world may come from that bi g hole in the sky, or a Gaddafi and the atom bomb.

Despite the occasional Asian-European social gatherings (mere window dressin g those) in London, the fact that Singaporeans gravitated towards or confined themselves to each other (so do most other minority races everywhere else), taught me we did not belong.

Nor did the fact that I had to hesitate - then refrain - from unleashing a fluent stream of East End expletives when a native cut into my path on the road.

How can you feel at home when you cannot behave as you would at home?

I have met Singaporean friends who have settled in Perth.

They are comfortable there: cost of living, especially housing, is relativel y low, no hectoring government, and the pace is so leisurely, and there are such generous social security payments that make it so attractive to remain unemployed. But, like all minorities, they behave like minority communities.

In any case, that incident on a civilised golf course when a horde of Australians charged at me mouthing a litany of popular Aussie also reinforced my diffidence in alien environments. And all I did was ask a son of theirs whether he had mistakenly picked up my errant golf ball.

Let's just consider the short-term headaches of emigration:

* THE problem of physically relocating and re-establishing your family in a new community and new country (for me, moving to Seletar was tough enough).

* THE task of re-establishing yourself in your profession or business in a country where you know nobody, apart from the few who emigrated before you, or the odd local friend or two. There's no old-boy network for you there.

* THE realisation at some time that, everything else being equal, your colou r or crook of your nose puts you at a disadvantage in the final award of that contract, a scholarship, a job, a place somewhere.

Even among themselves, a different accent is cause for discrimination. Recen t reports of American universities restricting the number of new Asian undergraduates reinforces this point.

* IF you are a medical practitioner in a government-run hospital, some old lady might ask to be treated by her own kind instead.

* YOU have no or few childhood friends; and how important they are to everybody, not just Singaporeans, especially as we age and our circle of friends and close relatives narrows year by year.

Even if you are young, think of the times you run low on cash, say on a weekend (before ATMs), and have no bank overdraft and no one you are confident enough in to turn to for that loan of $10.

* YOUR children might be the butt of some insensitive remarks by other children (and you know how cruel children can be), and adults ...'chinky chonky Chinese'... 'slit-eye nips'... 'stinking niggers' (all darker skin people are stinking niggers)...

* LAST but not least, you cannot stick your head out of your car at will and

call someone somebody's illegitimate son.

I believe for every point mentioned, someone living abroad will provide rebuttal.

But they should be reminded of the long-term and historical lessons against being a minority community.

By all means emigrate, if you can establish your racial community as a majority in your new land, but there are no uninhabited, unclaimed continents or islands left these days.

In any case, what's the point of going somewhere else to establish another racial enclave, when our forefathers have successfully done it here?

Consider one possible native view of immigrants: you are an interloper who plants yourself in his house/home after he has established it.

However, I am convinced, genocide - with you, your family and your minority racial community as the target - is inevitable.

It is in the realm of human and animal behaviour to destroy others to ensure

their own survival, roughly in this order: aliens first (other species, then other subdivisions of the same species, then other tribes of the same race), going down the scale till we turn on our own families, then on ourselves.

If you must emigrate, these then must be your only destinations: China for Chinese Singaporeans, India for Indians, Malaysia for Malays, Eurasians...

If we cannot or should not, then let's make Singapore work better.

What if your CPF savings and other assets buy you a bungalow with a heated swimming pool in Vancouver? It does not buy you acceptance or a chameleonic blending with the other colours around you.

Let's return to the question: "Why do Singaporeans emigrate?"

Some, we hear, leave for such frivolous reasons as the desire to own a bette r car. While each reason does not tell much, together they hint at something deeper: a possible loss of faith, a growing alienation, especially among the more mobile higher-income Singaporeans.

Let us study these "frivolous" reasons to trace the genesis of that process that persuades them to leave, against reason.

These valuable Singaporeans are articulate, often only in the privacy and security of their clubs and homes.

They chaff among themselves over perceived injustices, and all manner of ill s - real or imagined.

They often blame our Government, the same one that has made in so short a time such a good living and physical environment possible for all, and for them especially.

The Cabinet ministers, as reported by Mr Lee Kuan Yew, have listed many cogent reasons they would put to would-be emigrants to persuade them to stay. Even if passion was missing, the cold reasons for staying are overwhelming.

Personally, I would probably leave - then only reluctantly - if those reason s and conditions were removed, or if Singapore's position in the sea around us becomes indefensible.

A lot of passion among S'poreans

Maybe, our ministers spoke more with their heads than their hearts. But there's a lot of passion among many serious-minded patriotic Singaporeans, though not adequately expressed.

Singing Stand up for Singapore is great, especially for the masses (more of whom, by the way, are staying and therefore need not stand up so much). But our higher income, professionals and intellectuals, need more than flag-waving to rouse or douse their passion. Maybe we could sit down and think - and then sing, this time with real feeling.

The Government believes it has provided Singaporeans the material reasons to

stay. Perhaps, it should start to work towards providing them with reasons for not leaving.

Why lose 4,000 of our own, and import 4,000 aliens, similarity of colour notwithstanding?

Singapore has provided the conditions for business to thrive, maybe at the sacrifice of other pursuits, though this is being remedied in some limited areas. Complaints against this may appear airy fairy and Western in origin. But it is one cause that has driven some to emigrate.
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
I recall we used to get a lot of these types of comments in the old days and prior to the advent of Internet.
 

tanwahtiu

Alfrescian
Loyal
I recall we used to get a lot of these types of comments in the old days and prior to the advent of Internet.
Singaporeans are cherries pickers. Ti kor liang ti kor chor, ti kor tak zhi main liu nang teo chor - a teochew nang says anywhere that is cooler let's go there and stood, anywhere there is free uni education for their kid they will go there and stood. Many Singaporeans want cheap oversea ang moh uni educations for their kids and mass family migration suit them temporarily.
 
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kingrant

Alfrescian
Loyal
Singaporeans are cherries pickers. Ti kor liang ti kor chor, ti kor tak zhi main liu nang teo chor - a teochew nang says anywhere that is cooler let's go there and stood, anywhere there is free uni education for their kid they will go there and stood. Many Singaporeans want cheap oversea ang moh uni educations for their kids and mass family migration suit them temporarily.

Everybody would be a cherry picker if they have a choice. Would you buy that rotten orange? Would you not pick yr durians? Would you not go to the food stall that gives you best value for money? To cherry pick is not a sin. It spurs competition and with that comes improvements. So it is a virtue.

I emigrated because I can't stand this PAP govt. If they are removed in the next election or in the future, I will return. Any alternative party in govt is always worth trying. They may even excel over the PAP --given time. PAP fumbled in the beginning too. They had 40 years to perfect their style, but now I don't like it. They perfected it so well that nobody else can come up. So we have to let others try, and help them to improve.

The PAP clowns are overpaid. There are also clowns in Australia, Canada, UK, USA...but at least they are not overpaid, and you can remove them --really. There's more healthy debate in Parliament and freedom of speech and expression exist in the press, the courts, and broadcast media to query, to poke, to criticise and to check and balance the power of govt. Newspapers and TV/radio don't lionise govt officials and fawn at their feet. There is no need to boast that they are no. 1 this or that. Things move slower due to the volume of debates, but they still move, and I'll swop efficiency for that little more liberty, and people are satisfied that they have had their say and not have decisions and policies shoved down their throats. Civil society is livelier and spontaneous and street protesters and processions are not demonised by the govt or citizens but embraced as a necessary part and parcel of a democratic life.

There are other reasons too. Singapore being where and what it is, is a great place to work and play, but it is not a great place to live. One should park their family and homes elsewhere and come back to work and play. Ministers' sons are all doing that. Work play and leave on the fly!
 

jw5

Moderator
Moderator
Loyal
Everybody would be a cherry picker if they have a choice. Would you buy that rotten orange? Would you not pick yr durians? Would you not go to the food stall that gives you best value for money? To cherry pick is not a sin. It spurs competition and with that comes improvements. So it is a virtue.

I emigrated because I can't stand this PAP govt. If they are removed in the next election or in the future, I will return. Any alternative party in govt is always worth trying. They may even excel over the PAP --given time. PAP fumbled in the beginning too. They had 40 years to perfect their style, but now I don't like it. They perfected it so well that nobody else can come up. So we have to let others try, and help them to improve.

The PAP clowns are overpaid. There are also clowns in Australia, Canada, UK, USA...but at least they are not overpaid, and you can remove them --really. There's more healthy debate in Parliament and freedom of speech and expression exist in the press, the courts, and broadcast media to query, to poke, to criticise and to check and balance the power of govt. Newspapers and TV/radio don't lionise govt officials and fawn at their feet. There is no need to boast that they are no. 1 this or that. Things move slower due to the volume of debates, but they still move, and I'll swop efficiency for that little more liberty, and people are satisfied that they have had their say and not have decisions and policies shoved down their throats. Civil society is livelier and spontaneous and street protesters and processions are not demonised by the govt or citizens but embraced as a necessary part and parcel of a democratic life.

There are other reasons too. Singapore being where and what it is, is a great place to work and play, but it is not a great place to live. One should park their family and homes elsewhere and come back to work and play. Ministers' sons are all doing that. Work play and leave on the fly!
All the more reason you should stay and try to facilitate their removal.
If everyone like you chooses to leave, the country will be left with a bunch of elite policymakers, ass lickers and foreigners.
 

neddy

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Don't worry, nothing more will be revealed. There are dishonourable lines that I do not cross. Happy 2010. PTADER.

*************************************************

Source: 147th, 11 Sep 1989

Tough to be an immigrant in a minority community

Time to provide Singaporeans with reasons to stay


It is a lot less tough to be a minority in a more open society like Australia, than in a closed society like Singapore.

When we talk multicultural, let's not forget the "misfits" of a conforming society like gays, lesbians and those who felt trapped and unforgiven in a "conservative" Singapore society.

"Let a hundred flowers blossom" and a thousand ideas bloom.

From the Dark ages of Europe came the age of Renaissance or rebirth.

Meanwhile, what hope is there for a nation of 4,987,600 people with a hyper-sensitive government in a comfort zone, a Creative Technology long past its heydays, no idea, one opinion (155th > 147th) and climate change turning its low-lying areas into swimming pools.


H A P P Y N E W Y E A R !
 

kingrant

Alfrescian
Loyal
All the more reason you should stay and try to facilitate their removal.
If everyone like you chooses to leave, the country will be left with a bunch of elite policymakers, ass lickers and foreigners.

I still have my vote and if the Opp stands in my GRC and it is a 2-way fight, I'll put a cross for the opp anytime, which I have done since I could vote eons ago. I don't care if the Opp are pimps, bike thieves, ah longs; my vote is a protest vote. But if it is a 3 cornered contest, I'll bet on the better Opp team. I'll never vote for PAP clowns. I want to see Old Man's face when he loses more seats, if not losing the election! They need to be taught a good lesson.
 

Aussie Prick

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Loyal
Fast forward 20 years and ask the singaporeans in Perth what they think of the cost of living today and the rat race, pollution in Australia and the horrendous high cost of living etc...

20 years is a long time ago.........
 

jw5

Moderator
Moderator
Loyal
I still have my vote and if the Opp stands in my GRC and it is a 2-way fight, I'll put a cross for the opp anytime, which I have done since I could vote eons ago. I don't care if the Opp are pimps, bike thieves, ah longs; my vote is a protest vote. But if it is a 3 cornered contest, I'll bet on the better Opp team. I'll never vote for PAP clowns. I want to see Old Man's face when he loses more seats, if not losing the election! They need to be taught a good lesson.
What we want are strong opposition mps to speak up for the ordinary singaporean, not just anyone to oppose the pap.
I would certainly not vote for any bike thieves, pimps or ah longs, but I would vote for most opposition candidates.
 

IR123

Alfrescian
Loyal
There is one compelling reason to consider emigration away from Singapore.

It is also one that is not mentioned by the threadstarter.

I decline to mention it too, assuming that it is a deliberate oversight by the TS.

But it is enough to make life as a significant minority in a multi-cultural hotspot, an attractive option.
 

kingrant

Alfrescian
Loyal
I would certainly not vote for any bike thieves, pimps or ah longs, but I would vote for most opposition candidates.

How humiliating and insulting to the PAP if I did that, and showed them that I rated them below the pimps, the thieves and the ah longs. If all of 40% did that, they can't avoid the message loud and clear. All politicians are cheats and liars one way or another, or have lied to get ahead or get something. How does that not jive with pimps, bike thieves or ah longs?
 

neddy

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Fast forward 20 years and ask the singaporeans in Perth what they think of the cost of living today and the rat race, pollution in Australia and the horrendous high cost of living etc...

20 years is a long time ago.........

Obviously, your Perth relative is whining again.

6932 years - that is how long Americans investing in the money market will take to double their money, all US$4 trillion. The world has changed indeed. China is calling the shots these days.

20 years ago, I cannot find a decent toilet in China.
 

Aussie Prick

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Loyal
Obviously, your Perth relative is whining again.

6932 years - that is how long Americans investing in the money market will take to double their money, all US$4 trillion. The world has changed indeed. China is calling the shots these days.

20 years ago, I cannot find a decent toilet in China.

Ha the good thing about 20 years ago was the opportunities seemed more golden then and Australia was actually a nice place to migrate to. Look at what's happened. From now on I should just ask one powerful question to all in Australia: What happened?

The damm Chinese and their communal toilets.
 

axe168

Alfrescian
Loyal
Ha the good thing about 20 years ago was the opportunities seemed more golden then and Australia was actually a nice place to migrate to. Look at what's happened. From now on I should just ask one powerful question to all in Australia: What happened?.

You should ask from the powerful source : "Underground Resources". Try digging 100m deep down to understand why it is golden... heehee. Oh is it 20yrs ago or 20yrs from now ?
 

neddy

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Ha the good thing about 20 years ago was the opportunities seemed more golden then and Australia was actually a nice place to migrate to. Look at what's happened. From now on I should just ask one powerful question to all in Australia: What happened?

The damm Chinese and their communal toilets.

Perth is basically having growing up pains. Parts of it are held back by people who prefer a more intimate community feel of a small city, but there is no denying the fact that the city is growing of of its teens.

If you are working here, the price rise is less of an issue because even the cleaners have about 7-8% wage raise during the boom years.

But if you are planning a retirement in Perth, perhaps it may not be a good idea because the property prices here have gone up, AUD is up and overall living cost has gone up. Perth has boomed and unless you have ride the Singapore boom, you will find Perth has moved on another rung on the maturity of a city.

Perth is becoming a real city of melting pot culture. Some residents need to realise that.
 

redbull313

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Loyal
Ha the good thing about 20 years ago was the opportunities seemed more golden then and Australia was actually a nice place to migrate to. Look at what's happened. From now on I should just ask one powerful question to all in Australia: What happened?

The damm Chinese and their communal toilets.

I can tell you what happened to Perth and Sydney. They went down the toilet. They became places where the people were happy, laid back, people really did have "no worries" then

Now they have alot of worries!

Stress, fighting over parking places, no more laid back attitude among the people, ripp-off cheating prices on food, cars, housing etc and the charm, the very essence of Australia has been lost. The purpose of Australia is no more. Now its just another place you can work hard, long hours, and suffer through ripp-off prices and some of the largest mortgage payments you have ever seen in your life and the worst racism you can find. People are literally afraid to let thier children out on their own!

Shame on you Sydney, for becoming more expensive than New York. You have lost more than you have gained economically. Oh and by the way, New York is still better.

Shame on you Perth, for losing your laid back attitude and looking alot like a war zone with your terrible stressful life, traffic jams, and having property affordability comparable to London, England!

I am so glad I no longer live in Australia!
 
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