Chitchat China gives Trump the finger

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/03/yuan...rency-moves-wont-make-donald-trump-happy.html

Call it a New Year's greeting from the Chinese government to the incoming administration of Donald Trump.

As the president-elect rang in 2017 entertaining guests at his opulent Mar-a-Lago estate, China quietly ushered in a series of measures aimed at better controlling the value of its local currency, the yuan.

Unlike countries that mostly let markets determine the value of their currencies, Beijing tries to peg the yuan to a basket of other currencies. Starting Jan. 1, the Chinese State Administration of Foreign Exchange will use a new, broader basket of global currencies to benchmark the yuan's value. The change will have the effect of reducing the impact of the U.S. dollar on the official valuation.

"This is unambiguously bad news for the United States," High Frequency Economics Chief Economist Carl Weinberg said in a note to clients Tuesday. "China has put a new chip on the table to counter trade adventurism by the Trump administration."

A lot of countries including Singapore use a basket of currencies to peg their currencies. It give them a level of control that free float does not. China has for the last 2 decades however have manipulated its currency to keep it undervalued to ensure that its goods continue to be cheap for exports. The so called basket of currencies is a smoke screen. With a broader basket it harder for the US or anyone to show clearly the manipulation.

It looks like China is prepared to weaken its currency further at least for the next 4 years for the term of the Presidency to continue as they are.It might help with negotiations for the Chinese but I don't think it will impact the US outside of the weaker hand at the negotiation table. It also poorly reflects on China as it indicates they have no idea how to grow their economy or don't see a brighter near term future. Good luck to all those who invested in Chinese properties.

scroobal said:

A lot of countries including Singapore use a basket of currencies to peg their currencies. It give them a level of control that free float does not. China has for the last 2 decades however have manipulated its currency to keep it undervalued to ensure that its goods continue to be cheap for exports. The so called basket of currencies is a smoke screen. With a broader basket it harder for the US or anyone to show clearly the manipulation.

It looks like China is prepared to weaken its currency further at least for the next 4 years for the term of the Presidency to continue as they are.It might help with negotiations for the Chinese but I don't think it will impact the US outside of the weaker hand at the negotiation table. It also poorly reflects on China as it indicates they have no idea how to grow their economy or don't see a brighter near term future. Good luck to all those who invested in Chinese properties.

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Are you implying that Chinese are inferior when business and economics are involved ? Your "Good luck to all those who invested in Chinese properties" is way off-mark. Tell us the downside, when our property investments in Shanghai and Guangzhou have already grown by over 300%.

Reddog said:

Are you implying that Chinese are inferior when business and economics are involved ? Your "Good luck to all those who invested in Chinese properties" is way off-mark. Tell us the downside, when our property investments in Shanghai and Guangzhou have already grown by over 300%.

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I would agree. While many products are manufactured in China, it is because of the cheap labor costs that makes companies choose to have them made there. Other than that, there is nothing in terms of innovation, R&D and design coming out of China.

China needs a buyer for its goods. Why is it that China had for all these years accepted US T-bills as payment? Even when USD$ was deemed "worthless"?

It's because if the US doesn't buy, then who is China going to sell to? Singapore? LOL!

Trump will give China a hard bargain for sure.

scroobal said:

A lot of countries including Singapore use a basket of currencies to peg their currencies. It give them a level of control that free float does not. China has for the last 2 decades however have manipulated its currency to keep it undervalued to ensure that its goods continue to be cheap for exports. The so called basket of currencies is a smoke screen. With a broader basket it harder for the US or anyone to show clearly the manipulation.

It looks like China is prepared to weaken its currency further at least for the next 4 years for the term of the Presidency to continue as they are.It might help with negotiations for the Chinese but I don't think it will impact the US outside of the weaker hand at the negotiation table. It also poorly reflects on China as it indicates they have no idea how to grow their economy or don't see a brighter near term future. Good luck to all those who invested in Chinese properties.

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Trump doesn't care how the world perceives him and Ah Tiongs can't be bother either. The game is to win the war.

Let me make simple for you - sell it now. Up to 2008 I would have advised you to put your money in China. There is a reason why Chinese nationals are now buying properties in London, Vancouver, Australia, etc and why they also using casinos to launder money.

By the way, Chinese as a race are good at business second only to the Jews. China on the other hand is run by the CCP. 40million people died due to famine under Mao as they could not feed themselves. Get the picture and the context.

Reddog said:

Are you implying that Chinese are inferior when business and economics are involved ? Your "Good luck to all those who invested in Chinese properties" is way off-mark. Tell us the downside, when our property investments in Shanghai and Guangzhou have already grown by over 300%.

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nayr69sg said:

I would agree. While many products are manufactured in China, it is because of the cheap labor costs that makes companies choose to have them made there. Other than that, there is nothing in terms of innovation, R&D and design coming out of China.

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A country can grow despite not being innovative. Eg. Japan.

China needs a buyer for its goods. Why is it that China had for all these years accepted US T-bills as payment? Even when USD$ was deemed "worthless"?

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Every country that exports need buyer for their products. With fortress America mentality, China has Asia, South America and Africa as markets. And the Chinese are fueling domestic consumption as driver of growth too. China has more growth potential than US. Who or what is going to fuel demand in US? Amercian consumers are up to the nose in debt. The stimulus spending you may say ...well what happens to the consequent debt growth? That no longer becomes a concern because the Republicans run the show? Trump will bully the rating agencies into not reducing US debt ratings?

It's because if the US doesn't buy, then who is China going to sell to? Singapore? LOL!

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Trump will give China a hard bargain for sure.

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I think China will make Trump eat humble pie or launch a nuclear war.

winnipegjets said:

Trump doesn't care how the world perceives him and Ah Tiongs can't be bother either. The game is to win the war.

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china is resorting to 2 drastic actions on start of new year: central bank release over usd100b worth of yuan to banks and the money market to provide more liquidity, authorities reduce individual limits on cash tiongs can take out of cuntry from 200k yuan per person to 50k yuan per person. there's a cash crunch in china, and tiongs are exacerbating the problem by sneaking cash out of the cuntry and converting them to usd. they can take the next drastic action, and that is to strengthen the yuan so cash and capital flight does not reach panic stage. even that is difficult as investors around the world are pouring their capital and wealth into the u.s., and not china. at this juncture, there's near panic and the central bank of china has little to no clue how to stem the daily tsunami, and they resort to a series of "chicken running around with its head cut off" measures.

eatshitndie said:

china is resorting to 2 drastic actions on start of new year: central bank release over usd100b worth of yuan to banks and the money market to provide more liquidity, authorities reduce individual limits on cash tiongs can take out of cuntry from 200k yuan per person to 50k yuan per person. there's a cash crunch in china, and tiongs are exacerbating the problem by sneaking cash out of the cuntry and converting them to usd. they can take the next drastic action, and that is to strengthen the yuan so cash and capital flight does not reach panic stage. even that is difficult as investors around the world are pouring their capital and wealth into the u.s., and not china. at this juncture, there's near panic and the central bank of china has little to no clue how to stem the daily tsunami, and they resort to a series of "chicken running around with its head cut off" measures.

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The Chinese are smarter than you think. There is nothing to invest in America. With 80 percent of wealth commandeered by 20 percent of the working group, there isn't much wealth available for consumption.

Trump will have to trigger WW3 to boost the US economy.

eatshitndie said:

china is resorting to 2 drastic actions on start of new year: central bank release over usd100b worth of yuan to banks and the money market to provide more liquidity, authorities reduce individual limits on cash tiongs can take out of cuntry from 200k yuan per person to 50k yuan per person. there's a cash crunch in china, and tiongs are exacerbating the problem by sneaking cash out of the cuntry and converting them to usd. they can take the next drastic action, and that is to strengthen the yuan so cash and capital flight does not reach panic stage. even that is difficult as investors around the world are pouring their capital and wealth into the u.s., and not china. at this juncture, there's near panic and the central bank of china has little to no clue how to stem the daily tsunami, and they resort to a series of "chicken running around with its head cut off" measures.

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Any which way, with this measures to cut off capital flight, what will happen to our "private banking" and casino? That is the more important question.

Pinkieslut said:

Any which way, with this measures to cut off capital flight, what will happen to our "private banking" and casino? That is the more important question.

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when china was poor in the 70s/80s, sg survived and thrived by milking and outsmarting neighbors around her. she can still do the same, focusing on the 1% from mudland, indon, los, burma, failurepines. the proceeds are not as great as a 969-pound giant panda dumping its wealth in sg, but can scrap by. no fish, prawn also can. sg's future should be tied to the nations around her, not china. relying on too many stinking tiong thousand-year old eggs in 1 basket is not a good long term strategy for sg.

by the way, the main excuse given today by the central bank of china on the new limit of cash going out of cuntry is that every cuntry with a major currency is doing it at about the same amount, and the other excuse is to curb money laundering. for a tiong, it will be about usd6,969 instead of the previous usd27k. the timing of it and excuses given are suspicious at best.

eatshitndie said:

when china was poor in the 70s/80s, sg survived and thrived by milking and outsmarting neighbors around her. she can still do the same, focusing on the 1% from mudland, indon, los, burma, failurepines. the proceeds are not as great as a 969-pound giant panda dumping its wealth in sg, but can scrap by. no fish, prawn also can. sg's future should be tied to the nations around her, not china. relying on too many stinking tiong thousand-year old eggs in 1 basket is not a good long term strategy for sg.

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In other words we cannot afford to tell China to farkoff but can tell them to fark spider.

quelone said:

In other words we cannot afford to tell China to farkoff but can tell them to fark spider.

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they need to go fuck themselves.

eatshitndie said:

when china was poor in the 70s/80s, sg survived and thrived by milking and outsmarting neighbors around her. she can still do the same, focusing on the 1% from mudland, indon, los, burma, failurepines. the proceeds are not as great as a 969-pound giant panda dumping its wealth in sg, but can scrap by. no fish, prawn also can. sg's future should be tied to the nations around her, not china. relying on too many stinking tiong thousand-year old eggs in 1 basket is not a good long term strategy for sg.

by the way, the main excuse given today by the central bank of china on the new limit of cash going out of cuntry is that every cuntry with a major currency is doing it at about the same amount, and the other excuse is to curb money laundering. for a tiong, it will be about usd6,969 instead of the previous usd27k. the timing of it and excuses given are suspicious at best.

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China First versus America First ...let the war begin.

u know when it comes to economic prosperity and making money the chinese are relentless and single minded,if the chinks have to work 16 hours a day,plot,devise plan to make their country great again they would do it.america enough of ur bitching and worthless politicking just stand the fuck down.i hope u american fucktards both demo and rep slaughter each other to death or at least filibuster each other to death.

nayr69sg said:

I would agree. While many products are manufactured in China, it is because of the cheap labor costs that makes companies choose to have them made there. Other than that, there is nothing in terms of innovation, R&D and design coming out of China.

China needs a buyer for its goods. Why is it that China had for all these years accepted US T-bills as payment? Even when USD$ was deemed "worthless"?

It's because if the US doesn't buy, then who is China going to sell to? Singapore? LOL!

Trump will give China a hard bargain for sure.

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how do u accept t bills as payment?u mean china bought tbills to help prop america up when their economy was weak and also to strengthen their foreign disposition?

Someone please stop the hemorrhage! LOL!

China steps in to support yuan again as Trump inauguration nears

China stepped into both its onshore and offshore yuan markets to shore up the faltering yuan for a second day on Wednesday, sparking speculation that it wants a firm grip on the currency ahead of U.S. President-elect Donald Trump's inauguration.

The central bank set a stronger-than-expected daily trading midpoint for the yuan, state banks sold dollars and borrowing rates for the offshore component of the yuan rose, all hinting at state intervention to stem losses in the currency.

The moves helped the yuan inch up 0.1 despite strength in the global dollar index, while the offshore yuan hit a two-week high.

Global investors' jitters over the yuan are intensifying ahead of Trump's Jan. 20 inauguration. He had threatened during the election campaign to slap high import tariffs on Chinese goods and label Beijing a currency manipulator.

The supportive yuan midpoints and surge in borrowing rates suggested the People's Bank of China might have stepped up its action to defend the yuan to keep it from breaching the 7 per dollar level, Ken Cheung, Asian FX strategist at Mizuho Bank in Hong Kong, said in a note to clients.

"Trump's actual policy delivery and his stance against China are critical to the dollar and yuan direction in 2017," Cheung said.

"While China-U.S. tensions have been heating up in December, any provocation from Trump's administration after he takes office will easily escalate the risk of a trade war and spark a heavy CNH sell-off."

The PBOC set the midpoint rate at 6.9526 per dollar prior to the market open, weaker than the previous fix of 6.9498.

In the spot market, the yuan opened at 6.9565 per dollar and was changing hands at 6.9540 at 0800 GMT, stronger than the previous close.

It fell 6.6 percent against the dollar last year, its biggest one-year loss since 1994, and many market watchers expect it to soften further this year, forcing Beijing to burn through more of its foreign exchange reserves if it wants to stabilise it.

"The central bank is in the market to stop the yuan from falling too quickly," said a trader at a Chinese bank in Shanghai.

"The yuan fixing was stronger than expected today, and also state banks continue to offer dollars in the market," the trader said.

The offshore yuan was trading 5 percent stronger than the onshore spot at 6.9231 per dollar.

Offshore money markets have been tight all week, with the overnight yuan borrowing rate climbing on Tuesday to its highest level in more than three months.

The CNH Hong Kong Interbank Offered Rate benchmark (CNH Hibor) for overnight tenor set by the city's Treasury Markets Association (TMA), was fixed at 16.95 percent on Wednesday.

The rate was fixed at 17.76 percent a day earlier, the highest since Sept. 19.

Analysts said the surge in borrowing costs was a result of a shrinking yuan pool in Hong Kong, a result of fewer people seeking yuan-denominated assets owing to expectations the currency will weaken further.

"The depreciation expectation of the yuan remains and it takes time for investors to rebuild their confidence in the Chinese currency," said Liao Qun, China chief economist at Citic Bank International.

"Meanwhile, China has been making efforts to control capital outflows."

Forward markets showed investors still expect the yuan to weaken. Offshore one-year non-deliverable forwards contracts (NDFs) traded at 7.285, or 4.56 percent weaker than the midpoint.

almost there.... dow will likely go beyond 20k after inauguration day.