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Chitchat When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 month

democracy my butt

Alfrescian
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http://mil.news.sina.com.cn/china/2...c&mod=g&loc=5&r=15&doct=0&rfunc=8&tj=none&s=0

两岸开战怎么办?解析蔡英文军事战略能让台军撑多久
2016年12月12日 14:17 观察者网
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新浪扶翼 行业专区

  自蔡英文就任台湾地区领导人以来,两岸关系急转直下。台湾的军事新闻也热了起来,美国方面也频频在台湾问题搞小动作。在这样的背景下,台湾的军事战略是什么?最新一期《凤凰周刊》刊登特约撰稿人李侨的文章,分析蔡英文的军事战略。

  内容如下:

  《香港凤凰周刊》(ID:phoenixweekly)特约撰稿/ 李侨

  自两蒋时代以来,台湾军事战略像变戏法一样不断发生“豹变”,从“反攻大陆”到“防卫固守”,中途又变出“境外决战”的叫嚣。如今,守着经济萎靡不振、两岸关系面临冷冻的处境,二度“执政”的台湾民进党当局号称将推出迥异于前任马英九时代的新军事战略。

  据本港《亚太防务》杂志披露,在蔡英文的直接督导下,台湾当局最快将于2017年1月确定新军事战略的名称与内涵。可以肯定的是,这份军事战略既不会用陈水扁当局的“境外决战”噱头,也不会沿袭马英九当局常说的“固若磐石”理念,而随着军事战略改变,台军武器装备研发与采购也会随之调整,因此备受各界关注。
[点击查看大图]  2016年8月25日,蔡英文头戴钢盔、身穿迷彩防弹背心,在台湾南部屏东县举行的“汉光32号演习”期间发表讲话。

  建军重点是“不对称”

  当年在野时,蔡英文曾和民进党“大佬”谈过,早年陈水扁嚷嚷跟大陆搞“境外决战”完全超出台军能力范围、徒增笑柄,马英九的“固若磐石”战略又太过保守,如今,蔡英文入驻凯达格兰大道,如何提出体现“三军统帅”英明与权威的新战略,成了一个重要课题。

  知情人士透露,蔡英文曾向“国防部长”冯世宽提出过四个战略原则:一是“国防自主”;二是由以前的“有什么,打什么”,改成“打什么,有什么”;三是不准美方干扰;四是与各方学者座谈,不能闭门造车。其中,不准美方干扰有两层含义:一是美方认为大陆对台动武,最可能采取封锁方式;二是两岸若爆发军事冲突,防卫作战的准备应是设定美军不会也不可能军事介入,换言之,没有台美联合作战这种事。事实上,美方一直想探听蔡英文当局的军事战略调整方向,由于台美军售关系,美国对台湾防卫作战的影响不言而喻。

  蔡英文在2016年台湾“军人节”致辞时曾说,过去几十年间,缺乏上层军事战略指导更新,各军种按照自我本位建军备战,造成资源重复投入,导致军事投入效应无法最大化。她认为,现在威胁形态已明显改变,作战思维应有调整,尤其是随着募兵制逐渐到位,人力结构、人员数量和素质要求不同以往,台军在用人和经营管理上应有创新做法。据岛内绿营人士透露,新军事战略很大程度上沿袭民进党思想库“新境界文教基金会”在2015年5月提出的“2025年台湾军事防卫能力”蓝皮书的精神,着力构建应对大陆“第一击”的“不对称战力”,即台军总体上不奢求对大陆“先发制人”打击,但仍保留特定领域的防守反击能力,重点构建在新领域的优势兵力。

  有意思的是,围绕什么是“第一击”,蔡英文在上任前曾到“国防部”询问有关概念,有高级将领说大陆一发射导弹就算,也有高级将领说导弹快打到台湾本岛才算。由于涉及军种对防卫作战见解,蔡英文要军方拟订军事战略时一并澄清,“第一击”定义要清楚,因为这直接牵扯到台军作战指挥权责的归属。据悉,按照现行台湾“国防二法”,面对“第一击”的“反击权责”由“国防部长”承担,他下达指令并授权“参谋总长”执行。

  在建军方面,新军事战略会着重于“不对称”领域,在财力负担许可范围内提供最优质的武器装备,除了全面提升单兵个人装备、延续现有采购项目外,蔡英文当局将以“对外合作、本土研制”的途径,主动整建下一代军事能力。

  专家认为,如果实施新军事战略,将令未来的台湾防务投资出现“大翻转”。以建立“第四军种”网军为例,网络战没有战时与平时之分,是一场每分每秒都在进行的“无形战争”,一旦组建独立军种,绝非把各军种下的相关资源加以结合就够了,而是投入更多资源在新军种身上。这势必冲击原来各军种的预算分配,造成一场新的军种资源争夺战。在敏感的潜艇部分,蔡英文早在上台前就表达强烈的“潜舰(艇)国造”倾向,因此新军事战略会进一步推动台湾自制潜艇的步伐,不过由于台湾自制潜艇的技术难题甚多,很多关键技术还有求于人,前景是否如蔡英文所想的那么乐观,仍有待观察。

  更微妙的是,2015年底,台湾海军建造两栖船坞登陆舰与多功能直升机两栖攻击舰的“鸿运计划”被曝光,原本规划同时开工建造,但因外有美方压力,内有“国防部”不支持的“夹杀”,最后台湾海军只好根据预算争取与兵力需求的优先次序,确定先建造1.6万吨级两栖船坞登陆舰,待完工并通过作战测评服役后,再建造1.8万吨级“多功能直升机两栖攻击舰”。

  台湾当局人士曾提到,要维持现有海空投送能力以维护海上运输线安全,并可执行海外人道救援与灾害救助。要达到这项任务目标,除了空军的P-3C反潜机和C-130运输机外,就只剩海军舰艇有此能力。这艘被“夹杀”的“多功能直升机两栖攻击舰”,其建造时程是否提前,就看蔡英文当局落实新战略的决心了。

  台军能撑多久?

  当然,无论“蔡英文军事战略”如何布局,岛内民众最关心的还是两岸万一开打,“台军可以撑多久”这个话题--从蒋仲苓、唐飞、汤曜明、伍世文、李杰、高华柱、严明到冯世宽,历任台湾“国防部长”都会被“立法委员”问到。最新的动态是,2016年9月21日,冯世宽在“立法院”进行业务报告,他答复“立法委员”相关质询时强调,“我们绝对能坚持超过一个星期以上。”相比过去,“一个星期以上”不是时间最短的,前“国防部长”唐飞当年曾说过只能抵抗几天。

  或许因为军种出身不同,每位“国防部长”对台海作战构想都有自己的认知,所给出的答案背后也代表军种的用兵思想。一般来说,台海战事能撑两周是“标准答案”。但撑多久,因军种见解有所不同,时间略有灵活性伸缩。一般而言,海空军均认为,当他们的战斗力耗尽时,战事等于结束,而陆军将领则认为要等到解放军登陆占领才能算数,所以陆军当“部长”的多半认为可以撑久些。

  唐飞是几位“国防部长”中认为台海战局所能撑的天数最少的人。他曾在“立法院”表示,台湾的防卫重点不是撑多少天,即使如外界所说的台湾战备仅有14天,也早已决定出胜负了。唐飞是空军出身,空军持的论点是,如果台海丧失制空权,海军与陆军失去空中掩护,战局等于结束。至于陆军,不少人认为可撑一个月,甚至更久,因为陆军不认为海空军打完了,战争便结束。在他们看来,解放军得登岸,打完滩头战还要打城镇战,甚至有高级将领主张编练“山地旅”,到中央山脉打游击。所以,解放军要“占领”台湾得要打上好一段时间,“两周绝对拿不下来”。

  有趣的是,李杰出身海军,其“两周说”刚好是分水岭,空军多半在两周以下,陆军则在两周以上。当然也有例外,空军出身的严明曾保证可打一个月,陆军的高华柱则说不会少于一个星期。

  事实上,台湾防卫重点在于能否顶住大陆“第一击”以及让大陆付出多少代价,这样的代价大陆是否负担得起,与台军能撑多少天并无多少关系。台湾“中华战略学会”研究员张竞认为,由于台湾“国防法”第十条明确规定防务政策为“行政院”层面的职权,因此“蔡英文军事战略”到底是基于“国防部”层面来制定实施,还是通过“行政院”跨部会协调实施,其效果大为不同。如果各方势力不能“摆平”,那么极有可能像当初马英九当局推动募兵制,所有责任都推到“国防部”,却在“行政院”层面得不到支持那般,变成“高度不足、格局不够”的“夹生饭”。

  张竞还认为,“蔡英文军事战略”在推出之际如果没有拿出配套的预算规划,那也是“空中楼阁”,毕竟要办成事少不了花钱。眼见岛内经济哀鸿遍野,如何筹措足够的建军开支,着实令蔡英文团队伤透脑筋。
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Without the very important contribution of the 9 Terrex to defend the brothels outside Hukou Armour camp, ROC is doomed to rapid invasion by China.
 

AsiaDK

Alfrescian
Loyal
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 month

Will US come to Taiwan's defence if China invades? - Maybe but Japan is the one who will certainly assist Taiwan in a full-scale war. Japan sees Taiwan as their "most southern island" during colonial times. A war in Taiwan gives Japan a legit reason to re-arm and possess nuclear weapons, as they have the know-how.

A naval war in NE Asia means that China will outright cede South China Sea. All the small claimant states will move to repossess the islands with the US Pacific fleet & Australia behind them. China will not want to fight war with Taiwan and SCS claimants concurrently.

President Trump is on more friendly terms with Putin. http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news...ties-at-risk-while-wooing-russia/3362620.html

If the war escalates and involves US and Russia directly, the Russia bear will hibernate during the early days of such conflicts and harvest when China is exhausted. It is common sense that Russia will want to run territories "down-under" in China with obedient citizens, rather than a distant mainland USA; Russia has systematically devour Chinese lands since WWI/II and Xinjiang, Inner Mongolia and Liaoning will be splendid new additions.

China is walking into a trap if they invade Taiwan.
 

AsiaDK

Alfrescian
Loyal
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Without the very important contribution of the 9 Terrex to defend the brothels outside Hukou Armour camp, ROC is doomed to rapid invasion by China.

The relationship of the current leadership in China and Singapore, are like children whose fathers were great pals. It has been three weeks, and I don't understand why China must go all out to embarrass and humiliate Singapore to such an extend. Giving face is a kind of respect in Chinese culture.

Even when gangsters go around intimidate people, they know that they must provide a way-out to offer closure and not force people into a corner to avoid retaliation.
 

parrardee

Alfrescian
Loyal
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Will US come to Taiwan's defence if China invades? - Maybe but Japan is the one who will certainly assist Taiwan in a full-scale war. Japan sees Taiwan as their "most southern island" during colonial times. A war in Taiwan gives Japan a legit reason to re-arm and possess nuclear weapons, as they have the know-how.

A naval war in NE Asia means that China will outright cede South China Sea. All the small claimant states will move to repossess the islands with the US Pacific fleet & Australia behind them. China will not want to fight war with Taiwan and SCS claimants concurrently.

President Trump is on more friendly terms with Putin. http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news...ties-at-risk-while-wooing-russia/3362620.html

If the war escalates and involves US and Russia directly, the Russia bear will hibernate during the early days of such conflicts and harvest when China is exhausted. It is common sense that Russia will want to run territories "down-under" in China with obedient citizens, rather than a distant mainland USA; Russia has systematically devour Chinese lands since WWI/II and Xinjiang, Inner Mongolia and Liaoning will be splendid new additions.

China is walking into a trap if they invade Taiwan.

I agree with your observations and had posted as such although not in that kind of detail, however some one brain celled person on this forum asked me if I had kopi with Putin to receive such insights. China will not dare take Taiwan because of the possible repercussions which will be too much for it to handle.
 

AsiaDK

Alfrescian
Loyal
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

I agree with your observations and had posted as such although not in that kind of detail, however some one brain celled person on this forum asked me if I had kopi with Putin to receive such insights. China will not dare take Taiwan because of the possible repercussions which will be too much for it to handle.

Thank you and i am humbled.
the puny-celled individual had sufficiently humiliated me as a newbie, I will try my best to adapt to the ecology in this forum.
 

parrardee

Alfrescian
Loyal
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Thank you and i am humbled.
the puny-celled individual had sufficiently humiliated me as a newbie, I will try my best to adapt to the ecology in this forum.

The individual who is brain cell challenged has not the wherewithal to humiliate anyone but himself.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Will US come to Taiwan's defence if China invades? - Maybe but Japan is the one who will certainly assist Taiwan in a full-scale war. Japan sees Taiwan as their "most southern island" during colonial times. A war in Taiwan gives Japan a legit reason to re-arm and possess nuclear weapons, as they have the know-how.

A naval war in NE Asia means that China will outright cede South China Sea. All the small claimant states will move to repossess the islands with the US Pacific fleet & Australia behind them. China will not want to fight war with Taiwan and SCS claimants concurrently.

President Trump is on more friendly terms with Putin. http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news...ties-at-risk-while-wooing-russia/3362620.html

If the war escalates and involves US and Russia directly, the Russia bear will hibernate during the early days of such conflicts and harvest when China is exhausted. It is common sense that Russia will want to run territories "down-under" in China with obedient citizens, rather than a distant mainland USA; Russia has systematically devour Chinese lands since WWI/II and Xinjiang, Inner Mongolia and Liaoning will be splendid new additions.

China is walking into a trap if they invade Taiwan.

I don't know where you are getting this from, but there is No chance in hell that the Japanese will assist Taiwan in a full scale war. Their laws do not allow them to send their army overseas to fight for other countries. As well, Taiwan is not recognized by Japan at all, why the hell would they assist a country that is not recognized by them? Japan's biggest fear is North Korea, whom they treat as a rogue and unpredictable nation. They have no problems with China as may Japanese companies have billions $ invested in China manufacturing and vice versa. They are not stupid like Gay Loong is to antagonize China.

China has no aircraft carrier fleet to speak off and is decades away from even coming close to what the US currently has. It needs its illegal islands in the South China sea to be defacto bases and airfields in lieu of a carrier fleet. These islands are indefensible in times of war. In peacetime, they are being fraudulently used to project their territorial claims. The US knows this and they would not admit it, but frankly they care less. If they want to sail their fleet anywhere in the world, even up the Yangtze kiang, there is not much that China can do. There will be no all out war between Russia and China. its all saber rattling. At the peak of the cold war when these 2 countries were communists and the people poor as hell with long line ups for food and famine, these people had nothing to lose and their leadership were fanatical enough communists to push the nuclear button or go all out in a conventional war. That is not the case anymore. These 2 countries are in many ways more capitalistic then even the US. The number of rolls royce and luxury cars in Moscow and Beijing is mind boggling. The rich and powerful people in these 2 countries want to have a war or any kind like they want a hole in heir heads.
 

frenchbriefs

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Will US come to Taiwan's defence if China invades? - Maybe but Japan is the one who will certainly assist Taiwan in a full-scale war. Japan sees Taiwan as their "most southern island" during colonial times. A war in Taiwan gives Japan a legit reason to re-arm and possess nuclear weapons, as they have the know-how.

A naval war in NE Asia means that China will outright cede South China Sea. All the small claimant states will move to repossess the islands with the US Pacific fleet & Australia behind them. China will not want to fight war with Taiwan and SCS claimants concurrently.

President Trump is on more friendly terms with Putin. http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news...ties-at-risk-while-wooing-russia/3362620.html

If the war escalates and involves US and Russia directly, the Russia bear will hibernate during the early days of such conflicts and harvest when China is exhausted. It is common sense that Russia will want to run territories "down-under" in China with obedient citizens, rather than a distant mainland USA; Russia has systematically devour Chinese lands since WWI/II and Xinjiang, Inner Mongolia and Liaoning will be splendid new additions.

China is walking into a trap if they invade Taiwan.

south china sea and the spratley islands have already been reinforced by a air base and chinese copies of the highly advanced russian s400 anti air missiles,any plane taking off nearby will be shot down and the weapon will be used to project denial of air power.us pacific fleet consisting of who?a bunch of scraggly 3rd world countries?and australia has never participated in any major war except small skirmishes u expect them to stand up to china?
 

frenchbriefs

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

there is only one outcome if war breaks out between taiwan and China,it will be used as a testing ground for the military might of America and China and will be raped to shits like syria.it will then be split into two and renamed north taiwan and south taiwan,of course this time unlike previous communist blocs countries,north taiwan will be far far richer and more prosperous than south taiwan.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

south china sea and the spratley islands have already been reinforced by a air base and chinese copies of the highly advanced russian s400 anti air missiles,any plane taking off nearby will be shot down and the weapon will be used to project denial of air power.us pacific fleet consisting of who?a bunch of scraggly 3rd world countries?and australia has never participated in any major war except small skirmishes u expect them to stand up to china?

U are joking right? The S400 is shit useless if you are being targeted by a salvo of ALCM, and SLCM cruise missiles. These islands are stationary, every sq inch of these islands have already been surveyed in detail by US spy satellites. Every significant target on these islands have already been assigned a GPS co-ordinate. Once the cruise missiles take out the air defence network radar sites and anti aircraft missiles, the legacy fighters will drop their smart bombs on any remaining targets. Modern JDAMs have a range of up to 80km. There is going to be nothing left on the islands.
 

The_Hypocrite

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Taiwan joining China is just a matter of time. Due to economic reasons n for economic survival of the Taiwanese, China is the only hope n many Taiwanese know this. So there won't be a war..the Taiwanese are cowards n would rather live as slaves than die as free men. Many Taiwanese also support the joining of China under the 1 country 2 systems crap
 

frenchbriefs

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

U are joking right? The S400 is shit useless if you are being targeted by a salvo of ALCM, and SLCM cruise missiles. These islands are stationary, every sq inch of these islands have already been surveyed in detail by US spy satellites. Every significant target on these islands have already been assigned a GPS co-ordinate. Once the cruise missiles take out the air defence network radar sites and anti aircraft missiles, the legacy fighters will drop their smart bombs on any remaining targets. Modern JDAMs have a range of up to 80km. There is going to be nothing left on the islands.

I believe the s300 family have the ability to take out more than just planes,cruise missiles,harm missiles,anti radar missiles.and it's mobile and can be deployed anywhere in 5 minutes.but it's too expensive to shoot down missiles with s300 they will use something short range like Buk.also I believe Chinese have successfully developed and tested missiles that can kill satellites.
 

tanwahtiu

Alfrescian
Loyal
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

No Japan will not intervene too close to mighty dragon. China is not yesterday poor nation. Japan is a nation of grey hair people old people fight Simi lanjiao.
 

3_M

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Loyal
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Taiwan is hoping they can hold on and wait for reinforcement from USA. But the fact is USA has never promised they will get involved directly by sending planes and troops should an invasion takes place. The US is merely saying they are oblige to come to the 'aid' of Taiwan if war breaks out. What sort of 'aid' is still an unknown here. It could be sending in humanitarian aid, military supply aid or even could only be political aid by tabling a UNSC resolution against china.

My understanding is USA would unlikely get involve militarily should there be an arm conflict regardless the circumstances that leads to the situation. The American public don't have an appetite for that and what most important, why should US risks a nuclear war by confronting another nuclear power? It didn't happen when Russia annexed Crimea and it will unlikely happen when china retakes Taiwan.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Taiwan joining China is just a matter of time. Due to economic reasons n for economic survival of the Taiwanese, China is the only hope n many Taiwanese know this. So there won't be a war..the Taiwanese are cowards n would rather live as slaves than die as free men. Many Taiwanese also support the joining of China under the 1 country 2 systems crap

I agree with this.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

I believe the s300 family have the ability to take out more than just planes,cruise missiles,harm missiles,anti radar missiles.and it's mobile and can be deployed anywhere in 5 minutes.but it's too expensive to shoot down missiles with s300 they will use something short range like Buk.also I believe Chinese have successfully developed and tested missiles that can kill satellites.

In the first place, when they are thousands of km from China, you can immediately count less then 50% availability rate of the missiles due to lack of spares, servicing, etc. Even on a good day, in perfect circumstances, they are less then 100% availability rate. They might be able to get some cruise missiles coming in, but if the US launches 50 cruise missiles on one small island, there is no way they will get all of them. After that, JDAMs launched from 80km out is unstoppable. There is no missile yet that can defeat a precision guided free fall 1000lb bomb.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Taiwan is hoping they can hold on and wait for reinforcement from USA. But the fact is USA has never promised they will get involved directly by sending planes and troops should an invasion takes place. The US is merely saying they are oblige to come to the 'aid' of Taiwan if war breaks out. What sort of 'aid' is still an unknown here. It could be sending in humanitarian aid, military supply aid or even could only be political aid by tabling a UNSC resolution against china.

My understanding is USA would unlikely get involve militarily should there be an arm conflict regardless the circumstances that leads to the situation. The American public don't have an appetite for that and what most important, why should US risks a nuclear war by confronting another nuclear power? It didn't happen when Russia annexed Crimea and it will unlikely happen when china retakes Taiwan.

Agreed. There is a fairly large percentage of Taiwanese that want to see reunification with china. so, right odd the bat, an invasion of ROC by china is not likely to happen. the Taiwanese have drastically cut back their NS requirements which mean that they do not see china as a real military threat that cannot be coped with by its existing regular army. China will have a huge problem logistically invading ROC, if it even can. And they it would cost them very dearly too. Many PRC from Fujien province have an affinity with Taiwan, they will be uncomfortable over any invasion.
 

war is best form of peace

Alfrescian
Loyal
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

It is Constitutional Mission to Liberate Taiwan since PRC Day1. At any cost. They will do it regardlessly all factors and only a matter of time.

World can think anything, won't shack their mission.
 

The_Hypocrite

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Re: When PLA Liberate Taiwan, Taiwan belives they can withstand few days at most 1 mo

Agreed. There is a fairly large percentage of Taiwanese that want to see reunification with china. so, right odd the bat, an invasion of ROC by china is not likely to happen. the Taiwanese have drastically cut back their NS requirements which mean that they do not see china as a real military threat that cannot be coped with by its existing regular army. China will have a huge problem logistically invading ROC, if it even can. And they it would cost them very dearly too. Many PRC from Fujien province have an affinity with Taiwan, they will be uncomfortable over any invasion.

Fuckiens are known to conform to the powers that be. Fuckiens in fuckien province will just keep quiet. They won't rock the boat
 
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