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Another reason why we should pay airline pilots bus driver salaries.

kryonlight

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Leaked Flydubai recorder data reveals argument, panic in cockpit before ‘fatal nosedive’

The Flydubai FZ981 crash in Rostov-on-Don, Russia, could have followed the pilots’ failure to manage the landing after taking control of the system, media reveal citing flight data. The final minutes are said to have been full of arguments and screams of terror.

Now that decoding of the flight data recorders of the crashed Boeing is complete, an unnamed source told Russian daily Kommersant that pilot error is now dominating the investigation as the probable cause.

It appears that while trying to gain altitude after an unsuccessful landing attempt in bad weather, one of the pilots pulled the control stick up too much, causing a stall break and an uncontrollable nosedive.

The Interstate Aviation Committee believes that the official results of the decoding will be made public within a week or two.

Meanwhile, according to Kommersant’s sources, the recorder revealed that flight FZ981 had made two attempts to land in automatic mode, and since a veering squall wind hampered the second attempt, the pilot decided to make a third approach for landing in manual mode.

One of the pilots pressed the TOGA (Take off. Go around) button and turned off the autopilot, writes the daily.

Anonymous experts Kommersant talked to believe the pilot did not manage the diving rudder and horizontal stabilizer, which steer the plane in opposite directions – down and up, respectively.

When the pilot pulled up, he put both the rudder and stabilizer in a sharp climb mode, somewhat fighter-jet style, plus enacted the TOGA regime’s retracted flaps, decreasing ascending force. As a result, the aircraft lost speed and got into the beyond-stall angle of approach. All this led to an uncontrollable dive, the experts believe.

At that moment, the voice recorder is said to have registered a conflict between pilots. The pilot that tried to force the aircraft to gain altitude apparently turned the engines to powerful take-off mode, forcing the aircraft to continue its climb.

The other pilot believed the situation was dangerous and apparently did the opposite: he pushed his own control over to bring the Boeing’s nose down and prevent the sweeping up, while yelling at his colleague to stop doing it that way.

“Wait! Where are you flying? Stop! Stop!” a voice on the recorder reportedly yelled.

The pilots’ contrary actions caused the controls of the aircraft to ‘split’: the Boeing 737’s onboard computer was receiving mutually-exclusive commands from the two controls, which are usually operated synchronously. This rendered the plane out of control.

When they felt the plummeting sensation, the crew coordinated their actions, but it was already too late. The Boeing 737-800 was roaring at 325kph downwards at an angle of about 45 degrees. It burst into flames upon collision with the ground, killing all 62 people on board.

During the last seconds before the collision both pilots were screaming with terror, Kommersant reports.

On March 20, Russia’s Investigative Committee named pilot error or technical failure as the prime theories as to the cause of the Flydubai’s Boeing 737-800 crash in Rostov-on-Don on March 19.

It is unclear from the recording which pilot was doing what, Kommersant notes. At first the investigators even believed that only one man was speaking the whole time. Now, to identify the voices of the deceased pilots, the expertise of their former colleagues and even relatives may be needed.
 

kukubird59

Alfrescian
Loyal
At that moment, the voice recorder is said to have registered a conflict between pilots. The pilot that tried to force the aircraft to gain altitude apparently turned the engines to powerful take-off mode, forcing the aircraft to continue its climb.

The other pilot believed the situation was dangerous and apparently did the opposite: he pushed his own control over to bring the Boeing’s nose down and prevent the sweeping up, while yelling at his colleague to stop doing it that way.

“Wait! Where are you flying? Stop! Stop!” a voice on the recorder reportedly yelled.

The pilots’ contrary actions caused the controls of the aircraft to ‘split’: the Boeing 737’s onboard computer was receiving mutually-exclusive commands from the two controls, which are usually operated synchronously. This rendered the plane out of control.

hahaha...not sure this part is correct....
the fundamental control principle is that only 1 person/station/system must be in control at any 1 time.....
during landing, the captain is usually in control flying the airplane while the co-pilot will do the checks as per SOP....
it is strange that the plane need both pilots to control to fly/land...
 

jw5

Moderator
Moderator
Loyal
You can either pay airline pilots bus driver salaries or you can call bus drivers captains. :biggrin:
 

GoldenDragon

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
hahaha...not sure this part is correct....
the fundamental control principle is that only 1 person/station/system must be in control at any 1 time.....
during landing, the captain is usually in control flying the airplane while the co-pilot will do the checks as per SOP....
it is strange that the plane need both pilots to control to fly/land...


learn your dog commands first. you have yet to master 'fetch' and 'drop it.' now you wanna teach others on planes and pilots?
 

sadshishamo

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
I have for the most part left the industry but from what I gather for this flight , both of the pilots were Captains.....one the Commander and the other acting in the capacity of Copilot. These situations can arise when there is a shortage of First Officers and 2 Captains are paired up to mount a flight.
2 Captains on board may sound like a good thing ...on paper you have lots of flying hours and experience in the cockpit taking care of the flight but there is a flip side to the coin ....it is also like having 2 tigers on the same hill.
When exigencies arise both by natural instinct and training may want to take control of the situation....especially if he thinks the other pilot is not handling it correctly....whatever 'it' may be.

Even if it were a Captain and First Officer pairing, if the First Officer thought that the Captain was doing something wrong at a critical stage of the flight and if he felt that the flight was endangered, he would try to take over control.....this is also the natural thing to do unless the authority gradient was very high in the cockpit....for example a brand new First Officer flying with his Chief Pilot.

I do not pass judgement on this accident....I wasn't there.....I just wanted to point out that there could be times and occasions when 2 pilots may try to fight for control of the aircraft.

The plane does not as you say need both pilots to control or fly it. All planes and SOPs are designed for 1 pilot flying and the other monitoring and supporting the flying pilot.





hahaha...not sure this part is correct....
the fundamental control principle is that only 1 person/station/system must be in control at any 1 time.....
during landing, the captain is usually in control flying the airplane while the co-pilot will do the checks as per SOP....
it is strange that the plane need both pilots to control to fly/land...
 
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Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
hahaha...not sure this part is correct....
the fundamental control principle is that only 1 person/station/system must be in control at any 1 time.....
during landing, the captain is usually in control flying the airplane while the co-pilot will do the checks as per SOP....
it is strange that the plane need both pilots to control to fly/land...

Fundamental control principal your mother's cheebye lah. were you there in the cockpit? talk like you are a fucking pilot izzit? You know nothing What a fucking empty vessel.
 

Leongsam

High Order Twit / Low SES subject
Admin
Asset
Fundamental control principal your mother's cheebye lah. were you there in the cockpit? talk like you are a fucking pilot izzit? You know nothing What a fucking empty vessel.

He's just like you mouthing off over issues that you don't have sufficient IQ to comprehend.

I suggest you go to HWZ where the standard of debate is easier for you to follow.
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
Welcome back bro, good to have our resident aviation chief back.


I have for the most part left the industry but from what I gather for this flight , both of the pilots were Captains.....one the Commander and the other acting in the capacity of Copilot. These situations can arise when there is a shortage of First Officers and 2 Captains are paired up to mount a flight.
2 Captains on board may sound like a good thing ...on paper you have lots of flying hours and experience in the cockpit taking care of the flight but there is a flip side to the coin ....it is also like having 2 tigers on the same hill.
When exigencies arise both by natural instinct and training may want to take control of the situation....especially if he thinks the other pilot is not handling it correctly....whatever 'it' may be.

Even if it were a Captain and First Officer pairing, if the First Officer thought that the Captain was doing something wrong at a critical stage of the flight and if he felt that the flight was endangered, he would try to take over control.....this is also the natural thing to do unless the authority gradient was very high in the cockpit....for example a brand new First Officer flying with his Chief Pilot.

I do not pass judgement on this accident....I wasn't there.....I just wanted to point out that there could be times and occasions when 2 pilots may try to fight for control of the aircraft.

The plane does not as you say need both pilots to control or fly it. All planes and SOPs are designed for 1 pilot flying and the other monitoring and supporting the flying pilot.
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
He's just like you mouthing off over issues that you don't have sufficient IQ to comprehend.

I suggest you go to HWZ where the standard of debate is easier for you to follow.

Must be a new low for you, defending kukushit. take a break from this forum and go fuck each other's backside.
 

mojito

Alfrescian
Loyal
This is what happens when you have a copilot in parleement. Want to go right the other want to go left, end up the country crash. One pilot is all you need. :cool:
 

kukubird59

Alfrescian
Loyal
2 Captains on board may sound like a good thing ...on paper you have lots of flying hours and experience in the cockpit taking care of the flight but there is a flip side to the coin ....it is also like having 2 tigers on the same hill.
When exigencies arise both by natural instinct and training may want to take control of the situation....especially if he thinks the other pilot is not handling it correctly....whatever 'it' may be.

Even if it were a Captain and First Officer pairing, if the First Officer thought that the Captain was doing something wrong at a critical stage of the flight and if he felt that the flight was endangered, he would try to take over control.....this is also the natural thing to do unless the authority gradient was very high in the cockpit....for example a brand new First Officer flying with his Chief Pilot.

I do not pass judgement on this accident....I wasn't there.....I just wanted to point out that there could be times and occasions when 2 pilots may try to fight for control of the aircraft.

.
hahaha...thanks...it does appear that both pilots are trying to take control of the aircraft....but I thought basic design should take care of this....
pse clarify whether when the Captain is in control, can the co-pilot simply take over control of the aircraft without tacit approval (e.g. pressing a button to give permission) from the Captain???
The pilots’ contrary actions caused the controls of the aircraft to ‘split’: the Boeing 737’s onboard computer was receiving mutually-exclusive commands from the two controls, which are usually operated synchronously.
I was referring to this part....can both controls send independent commands to the onboard computer at the same time???
imo such a design is potentially a recipe for disaster...
 

Papsmearer

Alfrescian (InfP) - Comp
Generous Asset
I was referring to this part....can both controls send independent commands to the onboard computer at the same time???
imo such a design is potentially a recipe for disaster...

Of course its a recipe for disaster lah, you stupid cunt. If your right hand masturbates your bangla lover, and your left hand masturbate Sam Leong, both shoot at the same time, its definitely a recipe for disaster when u are covered in sperm, right?
 

frenchbriefs

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
This is what happens when you have a copilot in parleement. Want to go right the other want to go left, end up the country crash. One pilot is all you need. :cool:

it is only a danger during an emergency where split second decisions are required,in which case a hive mind is required and two brains merging into one and the superior instincts taking over.in normal circumstances,two conflicting A.I.s cannot exist together,ultron cannot exist without jarvis,both seeks to counteract each other.
 
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Narong Wongwan

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
This is what happens when you have a copilot in parleement. Want to go right the other want to go left, end up the country crash. One pilot is all you need. :cool:

Nabei cheebye the WP analogy was driver and co driver.....
Nothing about pilot and co pilot.....
No same same ok?
Bus driver can fly plane?
 

glockman

Old Fart
Asset
That is why must only fly SIA. Don't try Silkair because their pilot can commit suicide. If all else fail, take a slow boat.
 
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