Victor Lye - PAP's "Chee Soon Juan"

tanwahp · Mar 14, 2015

I have been observing this Victor Lye for months, and I find that he engages in very confrontational and destructive politics.

From a neutral perspective, you can say he's PAP's "Chee Soon Juan". Not the real Chee who is intelligent and writes many books, but the one who has been demonised by the PAP as confrontational and western style of politics. Note the "disruptive" way he operates within Aljunied, getting people to protest against the AHPETC, writes fiery language like CSJ's early days in politics.

The problem is, while we respect Chee, the PAP doesn't. If the PAP never tolerated what they felt was Chee Soon Juan's style of politics, why do they endorse people like Lye who engages in the same type of confrontational politics and give him a position of importance?

Sinkie · Mar 14, 2015

Dr Chee is confrontational? Show me proof.

tanwahp · Mar 14, 2015

Sinkie said:
Dr Chee is confrontational? Show me proof.

Yes the PAP need to prove that, but they will only prove by empty words like LHL who said this in 2006 about Chee:

"That he's a liar, he's a cheat, he's deceitful, he's confrontational and it's a destructive form of politics..."

The question for our dear PM is why is there someone as he describes in his ranks, and that's none other than Victor Lye.

Sinkie · Mar 14, 2015

tanwahp said:
Yes the PAP need to prove that, but they will only prove by empty words like LHL who said this in 2006 about Chee:

"That he's a liar, he's a cheat, he's deceitful, he's confrontational and it's a destructive form of politics..."

The question for our dear PM is why is there someone as he describes in his ranks, and that's none other than Victor Lye.

No. You need to show me proof, not PAP.
What LHL says about Dr Chee, he will account for it on his own, but your thread title clearly implies that Dr Chee is confrontational.
Do you believe Dr Chee is confrontational?

tanwahp · Mar 14, 2015

Sinkie said:
No. You need to show me proof, not PAP.
What LHL says about Dr Chee, he will account for it on his own, but your thread title clearly implies that Dr Chee is confrontational.
Do you believe Dr Chee is confrontational?

Mildly in the past, not any more. Hope that answers your question, but am sure you don't get my point and what I'm trying to say here.

Sinkie · Mar 14, 2015

tanwahp said:
Mildly in the past, not any more. Hope that answers your question, but am sure you don't get my point and what I'm trying to say here.

I get your point alright. But two wrongs do not make a right.

Just because Dr Chee help us to ask that wood where is our money, you chose to agree with that wood that a molotov cocktail was thrown at him.

Words can kill where bullets fail to penetrate.

tanwahp · Mar 14, 2015

Sinkie said:
you chose to agree with that wood that a molotov cocktail was thrown at him

Nope. Never agreed with him.

Sinkie · Mar 14, 2015

tanwahp said:
Nope. Never agreed with him.

If this is your position, the title of your thread is seriously ambiguous, misleading and inferential.

laksaboy · Mar 15, 2015

Chee Soon Juan is an intellectual. Victor Lye is just some grassroots scum from the insurance industry.

Confuseous · Mar 15, 2015

Victor Lye is a johnny-come-lately who is trying to make his mark in the political field after achieving "success" (in his own eyes) in the commercial world. He encompasses quite nicely the image of the PAP being retarded and totally oblivious to the fact that the SGs have moved on from such petty levels. He makes himself even smaller than he really is - as a man, as a representative of the ruling party.

jw5 · Mar 15, 2015

PAP actually secretly respect CSJ. However, he scares the shit out of them politically, hence they pretend not to respect him. :wink:

tanwahp said:
I have been observing this Victor Lye for months, and I find that he engages in very confrontational and destructive politics.

From a neutral perspective, you can say he's PAP's "Chee Soon Juan". Not the real Chee who is intelligent and writes many books, but the one who has been demonised by the PAP as confrontational and western style of politics. Note the "disruptive" way he operates within Aljunied, getting people to protest against the AHPETC, writes fiery language like CSJ's early days in politics.

The problem is, while we respect Chee, the PAP doesn't. If the PAP never tolerated what they felt was Chee Soon Juan's style of politics, why do they endorse people like Lye who engages in the same type of confrontational politics and give him a position of importance?

adultstem · Mar 15, 2015

jw5 said:
PAP actually secretly respect CSJ. However, he scares the shit out of them politically, hence they pretend not to respect him.

Yes you are right. I sensed that too. I respect CSJ for his political convictions.

He might be confrontational. But it is his message, which is powerful. This we cannot take away from him.

Thick Face Black Heart · Mar 15, 2015

tanwahp said:
I have been observing this Victor Lye for months, and I find that he engages in very confrontational and destructive politics.

From a neutral perspective, you can say he's PAP's "Chee Soon Juan". Not the real Chee who is intelligent and writes many books, but the one who has been demonised by the PAP as confrontational and western style of politics. Note the "disruptive" way he operates within Aljunied, getting people to protest against the AHPETC, writes fiery language like CSJ's early days in politics.

The problem is, while we respect Chee, the PAP doesn't. If the PAP never tolerated what they felt was Chee Soon Juan's style of politics, why do they endorse people like Lye who engages in the same type of confrontational politics and give him a position of importance?

The trouble is that it is the PAP who defines what "confrontational" means, and it is the PAP who assigns that term to various parties in order to demonize them in the eyes of the voters.

What is confrontational politics? If the govt is doing something very wrong, it is in fact every opposition party's duty to confront the govt. To confront in that context is to speak up for the rights of the people.

But the 60.1% have swallowed the PAP definition of "confrontational" politics to mean something very negative regardless of context, intent, and method of delivery.

This is the real poison the PAP has spread.

Sinkie · Mar 15, 2015

adultstem said:
Yes you are right. I sensed that too. I respect CSJ for his political convictions.

He might be confrontational. But it is his message, which is powerful. This we cannot take away from him.

Dr Chee MIGHT BE your father! I MIGHT BE your mother's lover too. So, for fucking gawd's sake, don't write like a wussy.
Is Dr Chee confrontational or not? Tell us. Say it like a man.

This is 2015 and it is darn stoopig of you to indulge in doublespeak, for fuck sake.

adultstem · Mar 15, 2015

Sinkie said:
Dr Chee MIGHT BE your father! I MIGHT BE your mother's lover too. So, for fucking gawd's sake, don't write like a wussy.
Is Dr Chee confrontational or not? Tell us. Say it like a man.

This is 2015 and it is darn stoopig of you to indulge in doublespeak, for fuck sake.

Didn't I say he was? I used the word 'might' as there's different ways of looking at it. I agree with Blackie. The PAP tries to paint him in a bad light. I like him to confront the PAP boldly. In this respect, yes... he is confrontational.

Sinkie · Mar 15, 2015

adultstem said:
Didn't I say he was? I used the word 'might' as there's different ways of looking at it. I agree with Blackie. The PAP tries to paint him in a bad light. I like him to confront the PAP boldly. In this respect, yes... he is confrontational.

There's ONLY ONE way to look at it. Confrontational is NOT such a complicated and difficult word to grasp, unless your comprehension of the word is wrong.

con·fron·ta·tion·al
ˌkänfrənˈtāSH(ə)n(ə)l/
adjective
adjective: confrontational
tending to deal with situations in an aggressive way; hostile or argumentative.

Being bold is not one of them.

Now, show me evidence Dr Chee has been aggressive, hostile or argumentative. If you feel that Opposition must bow down and be courteous then be considered not confrontational, then you've been a wussy all your life and any other more elevated and direct ways of addressing matters will to you be considered as confrontational.

Then I might as well say Pritam Singh is confrontational when he told Shanmu off in lumparliament that he does not need to explain to a non-resident! That for me is more lining on confrontational politics than what Dr Chee had ever been in all these years.

3_M · Mar 15, 2015

There is no such thing as morally right or wrong as politics is necessary evil and all that it does is political. If they can do anything to get the upper hand in this game of influencing voters perception,they win. I do believe WP have all the cards on hand, just that they are waiting for the right timing.

PAP probably can afford to get confrontational as they still have past credits to draw upon and more importantly they control MSM. This is something opposition don't enjoy. Csj didn't do his calculation and paid the price for his actions.

phouse3 · Mar 15, 2015

All the monikers in this thread are wayang IB. They are much more subtle now. They want to manipulate PAP into attacking CSJ. They have succeeded just recently.

http://forums.fuckwarezone.com.sg/e...6-vote-dr-chee-into-parliament-4736366-4.html
http://forums.fuckwarezone.com.sg/e...016-vote-out-lee-hsien-loong-4082393-160.html

Both threads are managed by wayang IB but framed on SDP. It worked magic.

10 Jan 2015: SDP launched its Election Campaign which was widely reported by MSM.
11 Jan 2015: the IB bumped up both threads.
15 Jan 2015: CCS attacked CSJ.
24 Jan 2015: GCT commented that CCS is poised for bigger role and Singapore needs to look forward.
1 Feb 2015: the IB was not happy with the truce, circulated rumours on CCS to create another fight.
http://forums.fuckwarezone.com.sg/eat-drink-man-woman-16/sex-scandal-vip-politician-4956116.html

phouse3 · Mar 15, 2015

SDP's first walkabout for 2015 was covered by CNA. http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/sdp-goes-on-

first/1613742.html

The IB was jealous. They simultaneously posted on TRS, TRE, ASS and EDMW that SDP is not working hard enough.

http://therealsingapore.com/content/i-support-sdp-i-also-think-theres-room-improvement
http://www.allsingaporestuff.com/article/sdp-need-walk-ground-more-sembawang-grc
http://forums.fuckwarezone.com.sg/e...oots-efforts-not-very-strong-leh-4949868.html

In 2014, the IB did did the same at TRS
http://therealsingapore.com/content/plea-sdp-please-work-harder-sembawang-grc

tanwahp · Mar 15, 2015

Thick Face Black Heart said:
The trouble is that it is the PAP who defines what "confrontational" means, and it is the PAP who assigns that term to various parties in order to demonize them in the eyes of the voters.

What is confrontational politics? If the govt is doing something very wrong, it is in fact every opposition party's duty to confront the govt. To confront in that context is to speak up for the rights of the people.

But the 60.1% have swallowed the PAP definition of "confrontational" politics to mean something very negative regardless of context, intent, and method of delivery.

This is the real poison the PAP has spread.

Which is why I feel WP should pin the label "confrontational" on Victor Lye but skip those other labels like "deceitful, liar etc".

SDP should also do the same. Chee had been giving examples of why he's not confrontational, and he's been put on defensive and a sitting duck. In the next election he won't face Victor Lye, but he might face another confrontational MP, Vikram Nair.

Victor Lye - PAP's "Chee Soon Juan"

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