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Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ.......

RafflesTiger

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Straits Times: WP loses appeal against $265,000 damages
http://wpsn.wordpress.com/category/1999-05/

In May 1999, “the Court of Appeal delivered a judgment that will pave the way for 10 people to pursue their petition to wind up the Workers’ Party.” If they had succeeded in winding up WP then, both JBJ and Low Thia Khiang would have lost their MP seat.

What had happened to that petition?

Did Low Thia Khiang managed to find the money and pay up? If so, how did he get the money? Why was it that he had the money to save his very own MP seat, but none for his old mentor?

But according to JBJ, they ultimately dropped their charges against WP but only focused against him?
http://www.singapore-window.org/sw00/001004jb.htm

“And now, eight individuals…..have commenced bankruptcy proceedings against me over a judgment they obtained against me, the Workers' Party, and A. Balakrishnan over an article (of which Balakrishnan was the author) in the party newspaper. Although the judgment is against the three, they have chosen to proceed only against me. They are represented by Mr Davinder Singh, the lawyer for Mr Lee Kuan Yew in another suit by him against me.”

The question is WHY?

Why did PAP drop their petition to wind up WP? They could have kicked Low Thia Khiang out of Parliament? And why was Low so passive in raising funds to help JBJ? JBJ had to seek outside help to help him raise funds. JBJ ultimately went on to sue Low and WP to help him defray cost.

The answer is quite simple: if PAP were to wind up WP, Low would be pushed to a corner and fight for own life. He would raise fund aggressively to save himself, and JBJ as well. Low was left out of the picture so that he would be more than happy sitting on the fence watching JBJ being destroyed while he prepared to take over WP. There was some form of unspoken, unacknowledged Nazi-Soviet Non-Aggression Pact between Low Thia Khiang and PAP against JBJ.

But it proved one thing: Low Thia Khiang and his supporters/donors are unwilling to help JBJ.











Francis Seow said Low did not help JBJ when he could have.. Instead, he took the chance to seize the leadership.. I surmise that he does not think Low is genuine opposition, even Gopolan Nair regularly takes pot shots at WP..

Do u guys know LKY has often spoken well of Low Thia Kiang... The PAP of today is hardly the PAP of yesterday but its the same with WP.. Have u seen the WP MPs debate in Parliament?? You guys truly believe WP will risk everything to champion your rights?? From their performance so far, I do not think so.. They steer well clear of the sensitive issues, if u know what I mean:smile:


Yaw Shin Leong might have been positioned as future WP leader as he is a PAP supporter, he openly declares how much he likes PAP..
 
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kingrant

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

The PAP already has a larger sample more than 17 times that of the WP. So there's enough sample size to make a judgment about PAP's MPs. But I am not too sure about WP - the sample size is still too small! When we can get a large enough sample as the PAP, then we can better compare! For now, the jury is still out on the WP, but we can indeed conclude that the PAP Mps are a useless bunch.
 

RafflesTiger

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

The PAP already has a larger sample more than 17 times that of the WP. So there's enough sample size to make a judgment about PAP's MPs. But I am not too sure about WP - the sample size is still too small! When we can get a large enough sample as the PAP, then we can better compare! For now, the jury is still out on the WP, but we can indeed conclude that the PAP Mps are a useless bunch.



I feel that WP has to be way better than this to survive, they just do not look the part, if u understand what I mean.. Opposition must dig dirt, challenge the incumbent, suffer a bit, the present WP is contented with status quo and I do believe that the electorate will not go fully with them.. Their cordial relationship with PAP is worrying...


Low may have been intended as an outlet for people who don't like PAP because he is acceptable to LKY..
 
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kingrant

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

Ya ya..LKY could have helped Ong Eng Guan back in the 1960s but he seized the leadership. Lim Chin Siong probably makes a better PM but then you know what? So what's the point?

At least LTK did not back stab JBJ unlike LKY on Lim Chin Siong.

Francis Seow said Low did not help JBJ when he could have.. Instead, he took the chance to seize the leadership..
 

RafflesTiger

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

Ya ya..LKY could have helped Ong Eng Guan back in the 1960s but he seized the leadership. Lim Chin Siong probably makes a better PM but then you know what? So what's the point?

At least LTK did not back stab JBJ unlike LKY on Lim Chin Siong.


What I mean is Wp seems pretty "soft"..... Compared to Lim Guan Eng and the likes... To beat PAP, they really have to be much much better and risk a bit more...
 

kingrant

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

I see where you are coming from. But they are not that strong yet. They are also mindful of an electorate that dislikes adversarial and raucous and polemical attacks, so they are treading carefully. They are up against a very strong incumbent, and incumbent normally has the advantage of being the better known entity, whereas for the WP or any challenger, sometimes they have to ask for a leap of faith, to give them a chance, and opening in the door. But I am sure after listening to the BE rallies, they are beginning to dig up dirt. But in parliament you have to be more circumspect until you have real solid evidence and not merely throwing darts.
 

methink

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

What I mean is Wp seems pretty "soft"..... Compared to Lim Guan Eng and the likes... To beat PAP, they really have to be much much better and risk a bit more...

For example the SDP?

I am not enamored with the WP soft approach. But between the evil PAP and soft WP, I have no choice but to vote WP for the moment.
 

zhihau

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

Francis Seow said Low did not help JBJ when he could have.. Instead, he took the chance to seize the leadership..

after JBJ's resignation from WP as a result of him being unable to pay for the libel suits, was there any CEC balloting to elect the new SG of WP back in 2001?
 

RafflesTiger

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

after JBJ's resignation from WP as a result of him being unable to pay for the libel suits, was there any CEC balloting to elect the new SG of WP back in 2001?




I don't think so.... Low just took it for his own... But I can check the book again to double confirm.. I don't think many of u have read the book.. Mostly it talks about Tang Liang Hong and the 1997 GE...
 
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kingrant

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

I agree with you. That's being practical, pragmatic and realistic. PAP's often touted virtues.

For example the SDP?

I am not enamored with the WP soft approach. But between the evil PAP and soft WP, I have no choice but to vote WP for the moment.
 

BusNo64

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

Yaw Shin Leong might have been positioned as future WP leader as he is a PAP supporter, he openly declares how much he likes PAP..

Dr Ong Chor Teck, why not use your old name Wayangparty?....LOL
 

RafflesTiger

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

For example the SDP?

I am not enamored with the WP soft approach. But between the evil PAP and soft WP, I have no choice but to vote WP for the moment.



I am glad u get my point and I respect all oponions... I am just uncomfortable to see WP so close to PAP
 

HTOLAS

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

There's been a spate of posts (here and on fb) that appear to hark back to the 'good old days' of JBJ and how he fought 'bravely', etc. Some of these even veer towards praising CSJ and the SDP for being examples of the 'real' opposition. But are these posts really glorifying someone who will never return (JBJ - Bless him) and yearning for another who as yet is unelectable (CSJ)?

I believe their true aim is neither nostalgia nor an urge for the 'real stuff'. Rather, it is a semi-skilled attempt to discredit the current WP leadership by faint rebuke.

These posts mirror the PAPzi leadership's attitude toward LTK. When he was WP's only elected MP, they damned him with faint (and sometimes, not so faint) praise. Since the last GE when he brought in six other elected MPs, and razor thin margins in several other constituencies, that attitude has changed sharply. They are now pouncing on every action WP makes as if it would tear, not only WP, but the entire opposition, nay, the whole nation, apart. And while they haven't quite said they preferred JBJ or CSJ, they are dropping hints that Singaporeans should wait for real (read 'perfect') opposition before electing any opposition.

Thankfully, Singaporeans haven't been that stupid. We know that everything, including being in opposition, takes practice. And we also know that it is much cheaper to get an opposition MP than pay a greenhorn minister (Kiqiu Lanfang Chan) and the likes of Salah Peiling to practise.
 

RafflesTiger

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

There's been a spate of posts (here and on fb) that appear to hark back to the 'good old days' of JBJ and how he fought 'bravely', etc. Some of these even veer towards praising CSJ and the SDP for being examples of the 'real' opposition. But are these posts really glorifying someone who will never return (JBJ - Bless him) and yearning for another who as yet is unelectable (CSJ)?

I believe their true aim is neither nostalgia nor an urge for the 'real stuff'. Rather, it is a semi-skilled attempt to discredit the current WP leadership by faint rebuke.

These posts mirror the PAPzi leadership's attitude toward LTK. When he was WP's only elected MP, they damned him with faint (and sometimes, not so faint) praise. Since the last GE when he brought in six other elected MPs, and razor thin margins in several other constituencies, that attitude has changed sharply. They are now pouncing on every action WP makes as if it would tear, not only WP, but the entire opposition, nay, the whole nation, apart. And while they haven't quite said they preferred JBJ or CSJ, they are dropping hints that Singaporeans should wait for real (read 'perfect') opposition before electing any opposition.

Thankfully, Singaporeans haven't been that stupid. We know that everything, including being in opposition, takes practice. And we also know that it is much cheaper to get an opposition MP than pay a greenhorn minister (Kiqiu Lanfang Chan) and the likes of Salah Peiling to practise.



Hi friend, you are free to disagree... But WP is really "soft" compared to DAP... Or DPP... My point is the same, the electorate will never go full out to support WP in their present form and composition... Just to be opposition and get a few seats, not a problem.. But anything more, I doubt


many people say political inclination is driven more by hatred than love... It seems true....
 
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zhihau

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

Some of these even veer towards praising CSJ and the SDP for being examples of the 'real' opposition.

honestly, me haven't forgotten what CSJ had done to CST and the SDP of the yesteryears...
 

RafflesTiger

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

honestly, me haven't forgotten what CSJ had done to CST and the SDP of the yesteryears...



I do not know how u guys view CSJ... But this is my take.. If the fellow wanted political asylum, there are at least a few countries which will take him immediately... He is staying to fight on because he believes in what he thinks is right.. Have u guys wondered why Low is never invited for international talks on human rights and Chee is always invited? And u almost don't see a single report by CNN on Low... Why?

Why does international media almost never refer to Low as opposition leader but always Chee
 
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HTOLAS

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

Sir, why are you comparing a fledgling political opposition with established ones like the DAP and DPP? The different populations' attitude towards opposition is also different. And why do you seem to think that WP's stance in parliament will remain as it is? Might it not evolve as they get more practice?

Since you like things 'tough', let me be a little tough on you. You are not my 'friend', so please do not address me as such.

Thank you.

Hi friend, you are free to disagree... But WP is really "soft" compared to DAP... Or DPP... My point is the same, the electorate will never go full out to support WP in their present form and composition... Just to be opposition and get a few seats, not a problem.. But anything more, I doubt


many people say political inclination is driven more by hatred than love... It seems true....
 
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BusNo64

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

I think u got the wrong fellow....

Did i ? .... from CNA forum, u come all the way to stir the same shit here..... yeah...post more from your pathetic temasek times shit here....o|o
 

zeddy

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Re: Francis Seow specifically mentioned in his book that Low could have helped JBJ...

Give WP some time.. They are outnumbered in Parliament by the Scums In White..

No level of playing field when a platoon of 7 soldiers goin to war against a battalion of enemy troops..

We need to send more Oppos to Parliament in 2016..
 
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